ArcheRage 3.5 Discussion
- Thread starter Sparkle
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By giving people a choice to do them whenever they feel like it, it forces the requirement of people to scout out these bosses 24/7 waiting for some semblance of life in an effort to disrupt another group from doing them. This forces people to prepare and actually be ready for a fight instead of trying to wait until the dead of night to muster up people to weasel it out.
If the 3.5 crafting changes go in, they absolutely cannot do the trade pack changes. If they do the trade pack changes, they should not increase the cost of crafting even if it removes the RNG in crafting. Both of these events happening hand-in-hand played a big part in ruining that portion of the game.
If they don't change the trading system, charcoal will either stay at current price or increase by about 30-50 silver because demand will increase. 3.5 crafting stuff costs MORE charcoal, not less. You should research more about the patch before telling others to research more about the patch. Each oil requires 1 of the previous type. Deeply Colored Oil requires 3 Dragon Essence Stabilizers AND an Emulsified Oil, one of which requires 9 charcoal AND a Viscous Glossy Oil, one of which requires 5 charcoal AND a Small Seed Oil. The amount of charcoal required in an Oil/Pigment/Polish increases, and with the crafting changes removing RNG from crafting comes an increase in material costs.
Mixcoatl's assessment of a Delphinad chestpiece means you go from needing 175 charcoal (50 Sturdy Ingots and 5 Rough Polishes = 150+25) to needing...
5 Rainbow Polish ((3+5+9)*5)=85
180 Sturdy Ingots 180 x 3 = 540
18 Rough Polishes 18 x (5+3) = 144
540 + 144 + 85 = 769 charcoal.
175 to 769.
...Can someone check my math before I commit to insulting the intelligence of anyone who thinks this patch increasing charcoal costs alone by 339% is a good thing?
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sociopathix
Active Member
From patch notes on http://forums.archeagegame.com/show...ge-Version-3.5-Patch-Notes-%96-Erenor-Eternal
- Go beyond Level 55 with Ancestral Levels and Ancestral Skill
Sounds good. - Visit new areas of Auroria: Whaleswell Straits, Whalesong Harbor, and Aegis Island
New zones sound good. - Old system, new tricks: Trading Update
This will destroy the economy. Rip the trade system straight out of that bitch. - Meet the new laws of conflict
This would be fine if it didn't take so many kills to push a zone between conflict/war stages. Peace should be shorter and the number of kills needed per stage should go down. - New Events!
These look fine. - Erenor Eternal Spotlight: Erenor Crafting & Regrades
Hard to say on this, really. I'm not really interested in the kind of grind required to create Erenor tier items. I'll never even have a legendary, so I'm not too excited about the fact that we're adding another rarity tier on top of mythic. The amount of resources and time necessary to get an Erenor seems mind-boggling. If it's not a must-have for pvp, I don't think it would bother most people, but if they end up being significantly stronger, you'll see a lot of people not interested much in pvp anymore.
goodmourning
Member
Please don't change crafting.... The 3.5 crafting system sucks so much.
The great parts of 3.5:
Ancestral skills and levels. Perhaps nerfing some things like Lightning Tiger Strike, and <SLIGHTLY> reducing the damage from Wave Meteor (it isn't as OP as people complain about). Also nerfing the AOE Sleep song. That was very dangerous, especially on Ocean battles. You can put entire ships to sleep with 1 person.
Whalesong/Aegis/Ipnysh quests. Fun zones, good content, introduced ancestral purses and crates, which were great for larceny.
Regrade percentage displays and better chances. Less of a RNG fuck fest gold sink grind P2W fest. Always a win.
Eternal Grade gear.
16x16 cottage upgradeables.
Cosmetics
Erenor gear. Actually good. Gives you a way to get great gear by putting in time and effort, not being forced to swipe to regrade to legendary/mythic. Anyone who puts in enough time an effort can achieve these pieces of gear, and they're actually good.
Transmuters. Allows you to reroll your gear to something that doesn't completely suck. HUGE bonus.
Reduction of warrior medal costs. They're already hard enough as it is to get.
Monster hunting gold increases. Good.
Auroran Metallic Crate drop rate increase (the chances of getting it from a mob)
Rebirth Trauma does not stop you from making portals.
The horrible, please no parts of 3.5:
Removal of Mana Wisps. GOD AWFUL IDEA. The mana wisp system was actually good, and a great way to make money for thousands of players.
The new Cargo Trade system. Absolutely terrible. Completely TANKED the game. Charcoal became so rare and hard to come by prices spiked to well over 4 gold for 1 charcoal in the first month on Live. Ruins sandbox gameplay, allows pirates to camp, and trade completely died.
A lot of recipes. For example, hereafter stones requiring Charcoal to craft. No.
Removing drills and majestic trees from the vocation shop. No. Leave them there.
Salvage Forge Removal. No. This was part of the mana wisp removal system. Mana wisps should stay in the game.
Ancestral skills and levels. Perhaps nerfing some things like Lightning Tiger Strike, and <SLIGHTLY> reducing the damage from Wave Meteor (it isn't as OP as people complain about). Also nerfing the AOE Sleep song. That was very dangerous, especially on Ocean battles. You can put entire ships to sleep with 1 person.
Whalesong/Aegis/Ipnysh quests. Fun zones, good content, introduced ancestral purses and crates, which were great for larceny.
Regrade percentage displays and better chances. Less of a RNG fuck fest gold sink grind P2W fest. Always a win.
Eternal Grade gear.
16x16 cottage upgradeables.
Cosmetics
Erenor gear. Actually good. Gives you a way to get great gear by putting in time and effort, not being forced to swipe to regrade to legendary/mythic. Anyone who puts in enough time an effort can achieve these pieces of gear, and they're actually good.
Transmuters. Allows you to reroll your gear to something that doesn't completely suck. HUGE bonus.
Reduction of warrior medal costs. They're already hard enough as it is to get.
Monster hunting gold increases. Good.
Auroran Metallic Crate drop rate increase (the chances of getting it from a mob)
Rebirth Trauma does not stop you from making portals.
The horrible, please no parts of 3.5:
Removal of Mana Wisps. GOD AWFUL IDEA. The mana wisp system was actually good, and a great way to make money for thousands of players.
The new Cargo Trade system. Absolutely terrible. Completely TANKED the game. Charcoal became so rare and hard to come by prices spiked to well over 4 gold for 1 charcoal in the first month on Live. Ruins sandbox gameplay, allows pirates to camp, and trade completely died.
A lot of recipes. For example, hereafter stones requiring Charcoal to craft. No.
Removing drills and majestic trees from the vocation shop. No. Leave them there.
Salvage Forge Removal. No. This was part of the mana wisp removal system. Mana wisps should stay in the game.
A big part of why I play this game is for the rng crafting, alot of people think that its cancer to rng your way to an upgradable piece of gear. But I have always felt more rewarded by the 3.0 system, getting an upgradable piece with the current crafting system is always a joy unless your crafting to just blow stuff up. also 3.5 ruined any kind of gold crafters made becuase it just became gather your mats and make your shit. I used crafting to make all my gold from 1.7-3.0 I cant stand to run packs shit is to boring and 3.5 made it so the only real good gold income is doing packs and cargo. I dont mind the addition of erenor gear, having made a erenor nodachi on live. Yea sure it cost me 200k+ to get it epic and it was cancer to grind out that gold but its end game gear be ready for cancer. And for the love of God dont add ancestral skills, sure they spice the game up a bit but people already complain about ccs and getting one shot, so IMO adding ancestral skills will just make people complain more. If we get ancestral skills the little pvp on the server there is will dwindle out as people get sick of getting hit by ( lightning tiger strike gale precision flame concussive mist missile rain wave meteor stone alarm call mist bubble and more)
just increase the regrade % and make the crafted gems either % higher or make it unbreakable or just lower the price of regrading and geming ty <3 but what ever u guys do will be for sure better than live
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witchbell
Member
I believe a majority of people disliked the trading changes from the 3.5 patch. It limited people's trading freedom for port hubs where everyone had to go for their commerce needs. It forced people into pvp situations do to this funneling of interaction which pretty much made them stakeout zones for thieves. PvP is a big part of archeage but it should occur naturally rather than forced through game mechanics. I prefer the trading system we have now where you have the freedom to trade wherever you wish.
The crafting changes are iffy. I personally enjoyed the changes as you can choose what kind of element you wanted for your gear. Some people are just looking for the specific type used for upgrades but for the odd types like meadow cloth they are much less desired and harder to find since most people just broke them for wisps. It made things more difficult for sellers but it was a great change for people looking to gear up in their own way. However the introduction of Erenor gear was arguable the worst part of the patch. The stats and raw power of that tier far outclassed everything else in the game. It was also costly so only the most wealthy players could even obtain one and upgrade it. It contributed to the gear gap and it will do the same here unless it comes with significant nerfs.
The regrade changes was a mixed bag. It made things easier for players going for dungeon gear or crafted gear but it made regrading obsidian and boss gear a pain. The changes was probably made to make crafted gear more appealing, a marketing ploy. People should have the choice to go which ever route they desire and still be competitive. There is no need to harm another gear line in favor for a different one. If you implement these changes plz give obsidian the same rates as crafted gear and leave boss gear under the difficult rates.
The Ancestral skills was a great addition to the game and it gave alternate ways to use your skills. If anything I would be great if you could add new elements to the those skills to give us more variety. Some players had some issues with certain skills like Flame Shell shield giving players an easier time against magic based bosses but I don't really see that as a big issue. I think there should be a separate thread created for that conversation so we could potentially tweak those skills if necessary.
The crafting changes are iffy. I personally enjoyed the changes as you can choose what kind of element you wanted for your gear. Some people are just looking for the specific type used for upgrades but for the odd types like meadow cloth they are much less desired and harder to find since most people just broke them for wisps. It made things more difficult for sellers but it was a great change for people looking to gear up in their own way. However the introduction of Erenor gear was arguable the worst part of the patch. The stats and raw power of that tier far outclassed everything else in the game. It was also costly so only the most wealthy players could even obtain one and upgrade it. It contributed to the gear gap and it will do the same here unless it comes with significant nerfs.
The regrade changes was a mixed bag. It made things easier for players going for dungeon gear or crafted gear but it made regrading obsidian and boss gear a pain. The changes was probably made to make crafted gear more appealing, a marketing ploy. People should have the choice to go which ever route they desire and still be competitive. There is no need to harm another gear line in favor for a different one. If you implement these changes plz give obsidian the same rates as crafted gear and leave boss gear under the difficult rates.
The Ancestral skills was a great addition to the game and it gave alternate ways to use your skills. If anything I would be great if you could add new elements to the those skills to give us more variety. Some players had some issues with certain skills like Flame Shell shield giving players an easier time against magic based bosses but I don't really see that as a big issue. I think there should be a separate thread created for that conversation so we could potentially tweak those skills if necessary.
Tempestuous
New Member
I'd like to start off by pointing out that I loved 3.5 and played it quite a bit on live. A lot of the naysayers don't have much experience with it and are only criticizing out of fear of change and having to adapt to new gearing/profit strategies. I loved the change to rng crafting, as the most <Unlucky> person on this server I very much appreciate not having to rely on luck in order to progress. Erenor especially gave me a way to slowly make progress towards better gear and get those small bits of satisfaction from upgrading. It's important for players to always feel like they're progressing in some way, be it more land, larger houses, new costumes, or gear upgrades. Reducing rng in gear upgrades but still keeping it challenging is my biggest request in terms of patch 3.5.
As for the new 3.5 trading system, that was absolutely terrible and definitely needs to be changed or not implemented at all. There were certain choke points that allowed a pirate like me to camp nearly 90% of all charcoal cargo packs. This would make me insanely wealthy and keep all the low gs players from getting any charcoal, other than buying overpriced charcoal on the AH (which I would set high). If this change happened, I'd have a blast for about a week, and then find myself on an empty server.
As for the new 3.5 trading system, that was absolutely terrible and definitely needs to be changed or not implemented at all. There were certain choke points that allowed a pirate like me to camp nearly 90% of all charcoal cargo packs. This would make me insanely wealthy and keep all the low gs players from getting any charcoal, other than buying overpriced charcoal on the AH (which I would set high). If this change happened, I'd have a blast for about a week, and then find myself on an empty server.
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This guy hates melee.Okay, here's my feedback about this, which changes i would like to see and which will most likely break the game, IMO.
(Anything in brackets is my own thoughts on the matter)
"Anything in quotes is directly from Trion patch notes".
I would like to see :
- "The Teleport Book now has a zone search option."
- Rebirth Trauma changes, such as - "You may now open Worldgates while under Rebirth Trauma." and "Players can now attack while under the Dominator’s Authority debuff, but their attacking/healing against NPCs is drastically reduced."
(Reason i want this is because it promotes pvp more than pve rushing)
- "Kraken spawns on Tuesday, Thursday, and Saturday, Disappears in 3 hours."
(Same with Red Dragon, DGS Despawn in 2h, Leviathan Despawn in 10. This limited the amount of no-life and eventually win situations)- "Leviathan’s attack patterns have been adjusted. The overall goal is to differentiate the phases he fights in and reduce the difficulty of his fight." (All Levi changes were aimed to make it easier, As far as i know, nobody tries Levi atm.)
- "The honor awarded as a part of Crimson and Grimghast Rifts has been improved:"
- Auroria trading (Iffy on this one, I don't have experience trading, as far as i remember Auroria trading was OK, someone feel free to comment on this who knows more about the trade systems.)
- "Mistsong Summit: Taris now takes Melee Damage!"
- "Transmuters can now be used to choose which item subtype you would like by re-cloaking the item. Cloaked items do not lose their grade, and are also required in upgrade crafting."
- "Reduced the amount of Warrior’s Medals to create Delphinad cloaks from 500 to 300. Reduced the amount of Warrior’s Medals to create Ayanad cloaks from 800 to 500."
- Ancestral Skills - anything not mentioned in the DO NOT BRING section.
- The Defense for all Plate equipment has been improved +20%. (Makes plate more relevant)
- Aegis and Whalesong - (I don't remember which patch they are from, but they were good methods of honor. The new content was generally good as far as i know.
- All the bug fixes in the patch
The DO NOT BRINGS:
In my opinion these are the core changes that ruined the game for many players.
- Specific Ancestral Skills!
- Wave meteor (Insane damage, i could wipe raids, fun for nobody)
- Lightning Triple Slash (Attacked the same target 3 times for the same amount of damage, normally 3 x 3000 damage for 9000 in one total unblockable skill.)
- Mist Bubble Trap (A placeable AOE Bubble, this changed the meta of mageballing for the worse, Fix by adding additional CC Breaks or reworking)
- Flame Spell Shield (Massive bug with this one, allowed users to kill Red Dragon without harpoons using reflect magic damage, Fix for PVE content and its fine)
- Flame Protective Wings (Same thing, reflected PVE Damage to kill bosses extremely fast)
- Flame Flamebolt (Users with extremely high magic attack would weave this skill with gods whip and one shot players, literally. Balance damage or exclude from backdrop + Increase Damage)
- Stone Alarm Call (Probably the worst skill of them all, Instant AOE Sleep, Balance bt adding cast time or decreasing duration dramatically.)- Trade Changes - (I will disclaim that i am not a trader and will probably not get this part right. As i understand it many players hated Trade outlets and the conversion from reguler packs to cargo etc. This system does not work with few players and thus wasn't a good fit for ArcheAge, Look for someone who knows this topic in these responses, this is possibly the biggest non-pvp change.)
- Regrade Changes - (This is often overlooked, but this change impacted the gear disparity among players. A lot of the changes were designed to make the strong stronger, such as easier legendary and mythic regrades. A rework of this system would be good. For example, Changing dungeon regrade percentages to be higher then crafted gear was a change that helped players who are not geared yet. I think this is an important topic and should be discussed more in the future to prevent gear gap as much as possible.
- "Dual Weapons Buff - No longer increases the skill damage for Triple Slash, Whirlwind Slash, Rapid Strike, or Overwhelm." (2H is already strong, no need for this.)
- Removing Wisps - (In my opinion, this change killed crafting and destroyed the archeum market. Since weapons broke down for archeum, archeum trees were no longer being done at the same capacity. this resulted in less content for many players. The salvaging and wisp system is working perfectly fine, and i would be fine with zero changes to this aspect.)
I'm sure there is more that i am forgetting, i will update this when i remember. At first glance though, there needs to be a lot of changes to this patch.
if you have conflicting opinions please respond and stay civil, let's make this patch as good as we can if its coming no matter what.
Erenor was a pain
Crafting differences were kind of a let down. But I did like the transmuters.
Trading was aweful.
If you take anything away from this, keep trading the same.
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Kezz
Active Member
I hope you don't use the same "material" update. What I mean by that is, don't make charcoal be on such a high demand. Make it a different material if you're going to proceed with that portion of the patch (and keep it secret). Same goes for any other material. Don't give people that chance to buy out the entire auction house in preparation for 3.5.
not guilty
New Member
I don't know if this has been mentioned yet, but for the love of christ please don't change the hereafter crafting recipe to require charcoal, bottlenecking the most fundamental consumable for this game to function was so cancerous- especially for new players who don't have access to basic resources or infrastructure, not to mention driving up the price of a charcoal the demand of which skyrocketed for the new recipes.
sociopathix
Active Member
Wasn't it also put for sale on general merchants for 75 silver?
You see, here's where you're wrong. Not even disagreeing with your opinion, just calling you wrong.
Retail has had this patch for a year and a half now. Since then, they introduced Hiram gear, which diverted gear progression away from crafting and towards grinding, like a traditional Korean MMO. Even with that, a year and a half is more than enough time for the system to normalize, for people to adapt to it, and for it to be embraced. 5.0 just dropped and they've reverted more than half of the trade system. Why? Because it doesn't work. When multiple servers on one Auction House cluster can't even make a system work in a year and a half, and when the devs even decide to scrap it and deem it a failure, that's not a problem with people criticizing something out of fear of change and lack of adaptation. It's because it was awful.
Sure, they removed RNG from crafting. They increased the amount of charcoal required by making all polishes/oils/pigments require the previous tier to craft (bottleneck), they increased the amount of materials needed to craft the gear by at least double while AT BEST increasing archeum acquisition by 30% (bottleneck) while also reducing the amount of charcoal introduced into the system with 45 minute trade runs (bottleneck). 3 massive bottlenecks to resources to craft items is not worth it. Charcoal prices going from 1g to 8g with thousands of players contributing towards the supply is not worth it. It's absolutely not worth it, no matter what you optimistic morons say otherwise. You want to know why?
I was a harbinger of this patch on retail forums. I eventually gave people like you the benefit of the doubt and stopped my hate about the patch. "You don't know how the system will pan out, you just don't like how it SOUNDS" was a very common theme with the optimists. However, we have the ability to look at retail now and it would be absolutely stupid to repeat history with this patch and all subsequent patches afterwards. The game on retail is fucking DEAD. Trion selling to Gamigo wasn't a nail in any coffin, they were on a downward spiral, else they wouldn't have needed to sell to Gamigo in the first place. The game was admittedly a failure for Legacy servers as per XL. Friends of mine who were die-hard whales and spent months playing this game because of sunk cost fallacy actually broke out of the fallacy and quit retail over this patch and the patches after it. The population is dead and you have to be dense as a neutron star not to see this and realize this patch was the beginning of the end.