Commerce right now is too OP

[Nitzaq]

Larceny already affects purses: it affects the items drop from the purses and labor you spend to open them.

That's actualy not true or way how it affects the loots is not making big change since i tried it not long time ago with all accessible buffs, there is no visible difference when you compare someone with 230k prof and somewone with 329,5k prof.

 

[ZielonyG]

IDEA 1: Keep purses as they are labor wise but apply "commerce buff" into opening purses - higher profficiency of lacreny = higher gold from opening.

IDEA 2: Keep purses as they are labor wise, apply "commerce buff", take all loot table from purses and put it in ancestral crate(without taking out old ancestral crate guaranteed drops), slightly increase ancestral crate basic labor cost to open.

Both ideas sounds good for me but prefer first one.

 

[Siëgfried]

if your goal was getting purses buffed is not a good idea just suggest nerf to a system we were asking for long time ago to be buffed and now works properly and everyone who actually does it to make gold is happy with it just to tie up the profits, larceny is actually good since crates are 5-6 gold each, but purses literally are worth to drag drop them cause the benefit from it compared to crates is simply not worth the labor. The thing is are you willing to spend 6 hr a day farming crates to spend your daily labor?. I would support a change to the purses (not whole larceny) .

 

[DrRageQuit]

Part of the issue is that larceny was nerfed, which on its own wasnt entirely unjustified. But then commerce was significantly buffed which effectively multiplied the nerf to larceny. I dont believe commerce should be nerfed as its in a good spot for people willing to commit the time, but for those without it larceny should be a great gap filler.

Repeating my opinion that crates should be left largely as they are, but purses should be buffed.

 

[Drunkenhero]

Purses are a middle finger to everyone who doesnt have the time to run packs. thanks for just completely dismissing the idea of changing that.

It's been changed enough.

 

[TripleDip]

i kinda agree with ragequit, no one farms purses cause the labor is just really bad compared to the labor needed and the gold return on packs, crates are pretty fantastic tbh, but they drop a lot less than purses, but cost the same labor? doesnt really make sense in my book, its just rough cause i see the purses i have, but then think of the outrageous amount of labor it takes to open them and then dont do it

 

[Drunkenhero]

i kinda agree with ragequit, no one farms purses cause the labor is just really bad compared to the labor needed and the gold return on packs, crates are pretty fantastic tbh, but they drop a lot less than purses, but cost the same labor? doesnt really make sense in my book, its just rough cause i see the purses i have, but then think of the outrageous amount of labor it takes to open them and then dont do it

Also doesn't require anything but braindead mob farming and then afk opening. Labor is free and regenerates. It's fine as is. Want more gold, do a trade run or make an item and sell it.

 

[Nitzaq]

Also doesn't require anything but braindead mob farming and then afk opening. Labor is free and regenerates. It's fine as is. Want more gold, do a trade run or make an item and sell it.

Making packs is more braindead than farming mobs tbh, for packs u can run them butt naked, all u need is just gold and materials - which both with gold u made before is easy to do. New players are also given 4 slot wagon on something on the way of blue salt quest or something like that which puts them in advantage in start.

For farming, well if you wanna farm u need to invest more time and more gold to make your gear good enough to be farming efficiently. People who are start the game wtih support pack can make ~200 purses per hour when people with finished or almost finished gear can do 6-8 times that if you wanna compare it to purse number.

Pack runners will with current sys make always more gold than purse/crate farmers. Lacreny need buff, not big one but slight one. Maybe administration doesn't want to do it because bots on servers are only purse farming - well u can make complex requirement for purse farmers to block bots from accessing boost ofc. Maybe simillar way as basalty title works with mining.

 

[Thriem]

I am for a increase to larceny but at the same time it is way better here than it was on live. So saying it has been buffed is true.

Can people stop comparing larceny to Trade packs! Not too long ago people were complaining it was the "only way" to use labor effective to make gold which makes it a grind fest. I will admit trade runs are a grind but a different one.

Safe trade runs can be brain dead when you get to the point of moving packs from point A to point B. Hostile zone trade runs are a different story and pay the most since % tend to be higher due to many people not chain running them to those locations.

Trade runs are VERY labor intensive. From making enough mats to support daily runs to crafting the packs and turning in. It also requires the ability to grow mass amounts of materials or buying them off the AH which supports the economy. It also lowers Cargo cost to make Onyx/dragon essence cheaper. It creates PvP and you can get yo shit stole. You lose nothing of value if you get PK while farming purses. Where as packs you lose all the labor, mats, missed profit and time.

**Purses do not have this same effect on the game** stop comparing the two.

Now that labor has more value due to the commerce change i understand why people that coin purse farm want a buff. I believe that scaling larceny based on prof would be best or change it so that the prof return is boosted a bit for people that enjoy farming purses. I think having several options of making good gold in this game will be a good thing

 

[Drunkenhero]

Making packs is more braindead than farming mobs tbh, for packs u can run them butt naked, all u need is just gold and materials - which both with gold u made before is easy to do. New players are also given 4 slot wagon on something on the way of blue salt quest or something like that which puts them in advantage in start.

For farming, well if you wanna farm u need to invest more time and more gold to make your gear good enough to be farming efficiently. People who are start the game wtih support pack can make ~200 purses per hour when people with finished or almost finished gear can do 6-8 times that if you wanna compare it to purse number.

Pack runners will with current sys make always more gold than purse/crate farmers. Lacreny need buff, not big one but slight one. Maybe administration doesn't want to do it because bots on servers are only purse farming - well u can make complex requirement for purse farmers to block bots from accessing boost ofc. Maybe simillar way as basalty title works with mining.

Whatever all that is, you can still completely afk open coin purses so it needs to never be on the same level as anything else.

 

[DrRageQuit]

Whatever all that is, you can still completely afk open coin purses so it needs to never be on the same level as anything else.

Nobody is asking for it to be on the same level. Just for it to be worth doing at all, which right now it isnt.

As i said before: Before commerce was buffed, larceny was "fine". But since then Commerce has seen massive buffs, particularly with the new gilda packs that offer large payouts. This is effectively a further nerf to larceny which has only been shoved backward as commerce got increased. I'm not saying Commerce should be nerfed, but certain aspects of larceny need some lovin'

 

[Nitzaq]

Whatever all that is, you can still completely afk open coin purses so it needs to never be on the same level as anything else.

It's not about comparing. To make gold out of packs u don't need much at all. To make same gold on farming purses/crates you need to spend 50+ hours on gearing from scratch if u have no help. To make packs u just need to spend time on getting lvl to be able to craft and u just follow quest to get free wagon and u just go pack running, your commerce is rising over time so is also the gold payout. Also when Sparkle mentions that "lacreny was buffed" i'll mention that labor nerf on purses that happened since how Sjinderson was explaining on debate channel on discord and probably same on forum: "there exists too much gold". And not long after we got commerce buff which doesnt touch gold generation at all, right? If gold generation was that freely accepted then as Ragequit told, lacreny needs some love.

 

[ZielonyG]

I decided to open today purses to check what gold i can get having 230k prof at 5k labor cap and this is what i got.

Forgot to remove all of archeum i had stacked so i cant show rest but belive me its not huge drop. Selling loot i get 615g for a around 30min farming mobs.

Commerce buff force almost everyone to do PACKS, people that used to getting their gold with larceny just moved to packs aswell cause its BEST money making method at this time.

 

[Sparkle]

It's not about comparing. To make gold out of packs u don't need much at all. To make same gold on farming purses/crates you need to spend 50+ hours on gearing from scratch if u have no help. To make packs u just need to spend time on getting lvl to be able to craft and u just follow quest to get free wagon and u just go pack running, your commerce is rising over time so is also the gold payout. Also when Sparkle mentions that "lacreny was buffed" i'll mention that labor nerf on purses that happened since how Sjinderson was explaining on debate channel on discord and probably same on forum: "there exists too much gold". And not long after we got commerce buff which doesnt touch gold generation at all, right? If gold generation was that freely accepted then as Ragequit told, lacreny needs some love.

Labor points requirement was slightly increased for the purses as gold from them was increased as well.​

When it costed less labor, it also provided less gold. When gold per purse was increased, labor cost was increased as well on all AA servers. We forgot to increase it in time, that’s why labor increase happened a bit later, but we still kept it almost twice lower than on any AA server.​

 

[Aviendha]

I decided to open today purses to check what gold i can get having 230k prof at 5k labor cap and this is what i got.

Forgot to remove all of archeum i had stacked so i cant show rest but belive me its not huge drop. Selling loot i get 615g for a around 30min farming mobs.

Commerce buff force almost everyone to do PACKS, people that used to getting their gold with larceny just moved to packs aswell cause its BEST money making method at this time.

I believe I said it's best to focus on crates, those drop 5g per 12 labor on average when you just count trees and braziers, and you only need 400ish to get through your 5k labor cap.

Save purses for when you'd otherwise craft taxes cuz you can't play on that day. Purses > taxes.

 

[Siëgfried]

I believe I said it's best to focus on crates, those drop 5g per 12 labor on average when you just count trees and braziers, and you only need 400ish to get through your 5k labor cap.

Save purses for when you'd otherwise craft taxes cuz you can't play on that day. Purses > taxes.

have you even tried to go out there and farm 600 crates daily?

 

[ZielonyG]

I believe I said it's best to focus on crates, those drop 5g per 12 labor on average when you just count trees and braziers, and you only need 400ish to get through your 5k labor cap.

Save purses for when you'd otherwise craft taxes cuz you can't play on that day. Purses > taxes.

Yeah i know wanted to show Sparkle how useless purses are right now.
And its pretty sad when u see in ur bag like 2k purses (2.4k gold around) and you know its not worth to open them and u have to farm 3-4h to burn daily labor regen

 

[Aviendha]

have you even tried to go out there and farm 600 crates daily?

Yes.

 

[Aviendha]

Yeah i know wanted to show Sparkle how useless purses are right now.
And its pretty sad when u see in ur bag like 2k purses (2.4k gold around) and you know its not worth to open them and u have to farm 3-4h to burn daily labor regen

Fair point, yea. I'd focus on different profs anyway, get crates from larceny, and do some other things along the side.

Opening purses used to be more worth it when lunarite was worth more. Old wave/fire lunarite from prince purses were super good drops back in the day, and fireglow lunarite from ancestrals after that. Seeing as lunarite price dropped hard, the purses lost their value.

 

[sugarrush]

I decided to open today purses to check what gold i can get having 230k prof at 5k labor cap and this is what i got.

Forgot to remove all of archeum i had stacked so i cant show rest but belive me its not huge drop. Selling loot i get 615g for a around 30min farming mobs.

Commerce buff force almost everyone to do PACKS, people that used to getting their gold with larceny just moved to packs aswell cause its BEST money making method at this time.

On the official version it was like that too where people were throwing away certain coin purses because they were not worth opening. I am glad the staff put the extra stuff in the purses but at the same time just because it is in there does not mean it will sell for any real profit. I don't think that coin purses and packs will ever truly be even as far as profit goes. If you remember before the commerce change ancestral purses were the best way to make gold and commerce suffered.

If you think about it, Coin purse farming is actually it is still better even with the changes in commerce. If you take 9 guilda packs at 78 gold each (rough estimate) that is 702 gold per cart. Or do what most people do is to make the 34 gold packs for 306 gold per cart but you spend 18 - 24 minutes traveling which can get boring really fast. You still have to get guilda stars but also add in the loss in profits from having to buy seeds. The extra labor needed to bundle the seeds, grow the compost to get worms and harvest that. More labor needed to harvest the plants, cut up certain plants for chopped produce, ground grain, ect. Then the extra labor needed to make the pack and then sell the pack. There is a lot more effort needed to make gold with packs vs kill monster, open purse = profit.

I forgot to add that the price goes down based on how many packs are being turned in by other people. With coin purses you have no such restrictions.