No, way to high compared to others. Things have to be somewhat balanced so all are used
Request: Make Thunder Dash's base speed higher than 10 m/s
- Thread starter camigwenn
- Start date
No, way to high compared to others. Things have to be somewhat balanced so all are used
smashahoe
Member
What's the point of making a mount that takes effort to get the same as ones you can just buy in cash shop?
On trion AA yes I would agree with you completely but on AR honor doesn't require all that much effort to get.
Thunder dash is the only mount I want and am slowly working on getting it (10k honor off) I don't want it to be the go to mount which everyone uses. Yes it needs a buff but 12.5 is far to much
camigwenn
Member
I agree, I'm not asking that it be faster than the Reindeer. But it certainly should AT LEAST be 11 m/s
Silverbranch
Member
Quoting this mainly because that statement is basically too good not to quote.
the "change" was a ham-fisted implementation met with immediate backlash when the western player base requested that cash shop mounts (and gliders, and costumes) be nerfed to be inferior to the farmed, and thus harder to acquire, crafted/earned variants. The hamfisted approach resulted in them simply standardizing everything (bar a few exceptions) and ruined it for everyone.
The general consensus was that people wanted cash shop mounts standardized so that earning a mount meant something, as it stands there's literally no point to ever work on a mount outside of stormdarter (never upgrade it, the upgrade is worse), or a reindeer. One of these is cash shop and the other is an afternoon of honor grinding.
With the situation as it currently is, you basically have the following -
Reindeer - Single best travel mount, faster and has movement abilities, swipe your card to claim
Mirage snowlion/snowlion - Invincidash
Stupid harani mount I can never remember the name of - Utility backward jump + stealth
The two best mounts are available solely through the cash store, the utility mount is 50s from a nooby zone.
No mount can match up to the reindeer for travel speed, regardless of the requirements (Edit: Castle mount is likely on par? I can't remember its skillset), and only snowlion-based other mounts are viable with their invincidash - At that point they're just a super expensive reskin of what someone could have just paid credits for, which isnt inherently bad, except the reindeer is still objectively better.
Also "staff" spouting meme's in a thread which raises a genuine point >_>
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Ernst
New Member
@Silverbranch I totally agree with the points you bring up here, it's not acceptable for someone to just say "Trion did it so it's okay." when that is clearly not the case.
@XiCynx I have also been compiling a list of mounts and potential changes that could be made, I'll PM you what I have so far.
All!
The mounts and their speed were discussed by us per your request.
Each mount has its own specifications and abilities that help with different in-game tasks.
Reindeer has no special skills, his biggest advantage is speed.
Other mounts have additional skills, that's why they loose in speed. If we increase speed for some of them the rest will just loose sense.
Right now we decided not to step out of normalization.
The mounts and their speed were discussed by us per your request.
Each mount has its own specifications and abilities that help with different in-game tasks.
Reindeer has no special skills, his biggest advantage is speed.
Other mounts have additional skills, that's why they loose in speed. If we increase speed for some of them the rest will just loose sense.
Right now we decided not to step out of normalization.
At least you took the time to inform us of your decision. thanks
smashahoe
Member
A cash shop mount shouldn't be faster than a mount that takes effort to get in game like Thunderdash. Just saying.
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camigwenn
Member
I'm not quite sure I understand this reasoning, as the Reindeers abilities are actually quite powerful. It has a pvp engage, a leap, a normal dash, and a 700% increased ranged attack arrow.
When you put mount armor on it, because of percentage scaling, it way outpaces other mounts.
Even a 0.5 ms speed increase to earned mounts would bring them up a bit.
Something to make us feel rewarded for a mount.
Why is Thunder Dash worse than it's inferior version?
Please, take another look at a few of the mounts.
I appreciate you guys actually looking into this though. Shows that you care at least.
echoes_of_eternity
Active Member
What are you even talking about? Brown Reindeer has five special skills just like most mounts, and its skills are arguably much better for PvP than any other mount.
Silverbranch
Member
Lalalalalalalala let's just ignore the entire thread of feedback and then spout some utterly inaccurate crap.
Ignoring the fact the reindeer has the best skillset outside of a snowlion base, only missing an invincidash, so I have no idea where you got
from.
Speed in Archerage is percentage scaling.
I'm on a 10 m/s mount, it has 9% movement speed increase from armor, and a 10% increase from songcraft, now honestly I can't remember if these are multiplicative or additive, but let's take the conservative view.
10 base + 0.9 armor + 1 songcraft = 11.9
So in this theoretical scenario, my thunderdash, a relatively 'prestigious' mount is going 11.9m/sec
Our challenger is the reindeer with a base speed of 11.5 (if memory serves)
11.5 base + 1.035 armor (lets round that down to 1) + 1.5 songcraft
This means the reindeer is averaging 14m/s outside of skill use.
That's a difference of 2.1m/sec, now I genuinely can't be bothered to do the math, but both the mounts have movement abilities.
Thunder has run, and invincible dash
Reindeer has run, and leap
Invincible dash doesn't have that far range, and whilst it is slightly longer than leap, if memory serves leap has a shorter cooldown, and combined with higher base movement speeds it averages a higher speed over distance.
So we've established that when it comes to speed, the reindeer beats thunder dash.
Looking at the differences between the mounts, in most scenarios, this can be summed down to
Invincible dash VS leap
Both are engagement skills, both function in combat roughly the same. So, yep, thunder dash is inferior to a reindeer.
But then let's turn it around and compare thunderdash, to a 10s snowlion.
Oh yep, the snowlion performs maybe 95% of the efficiency of a thunderdash, only missing skills such as roar, which if we're being honest never get used.
There is no way that with a straight face you can say that the mount system makes any sense what-so-ever. There is effectively no incentive to use any mount outside of the reindeer.
EDIT:
Wanted to again draw some attention to the fact that thunderdash is a mount evolution, but is inferior to the mount it evolves from.
Ignoring the fact the reindeer has the best skillset outside of a snowlion base, only missing an invincidash, so I have no idea where you got
from.
Speed in Archerage is percentage scaling.
I'm on a 10 m/s mount, it has 9% movement speed increase from armor, and a 10% increase from songcraft, now honestly I can't remember if these are multiplicative or additive, but let's take the conservative view.
10 base + 0.9 armor + 1 songcraft = 11.9
So in this theoretical scenario, my thunderdash, a relatively 'prestigious' mount is going 11.9m/sec
Our challenger is the reindeer with a base speed of 11.5 (if memory serves)
11.5 base + 1.035 armor (lets round that down to 1) + 1.5 songcraft
This means the reindeer is averaging 14m/s outside of skill use.
That's a difference of 2.1m/sec, now I genuinely can't be bothered to do the math, but both the mounts have movement abilities.
Thunder has run, and invincible dash
Reindeer has run, and leap
Invincible dash doesn't have that far range, and whilst it is slightly longer than leap, if memory serves leap has a shorter cooldown, and combined with higher base movement speeds it averages a higher speed over distance.
So we've established that when it comes to speed, the reindeer beats thunder dash.
Looking at the differences between the mounts, in most scenarios, this can be summed down to
Invincible dash VS leap
Both are engagement skills, both function in combat roughly the same. So, yep, thunder dash is inferior to a reindeer.
But then let's turn it around and compare thunderdash, to a 10s snowlion.
Oh yep, the snowlion performs maybe 95% of the efficiency of a thunderdash, only missing skills such as roar, which if we're being honest never get used.
There is no way that with a straight face you can say that the mount system makes any sense what-so-ever. There is effectively no incentive to use any mount outside of the reindeer.
EDIT:
Wanted to again draw some attention to the fact that thunderdash is a mount evolution, but is inferior to the mount it evolves from.
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camigwenn
Member
I agree with everything you said. However a few corrections;
As far as I know, the leap is 30 second cd, and Thunder Dash's ram is also a 30 second cd.
Also, it's not an invincibility dash, it's just a normal dash that trips enemies.
And yeah, the fear is super cool looking, but that's about it.
I have yet to use it against an enemy.
XiCynx
Active Member
The Leap is a 14 second cooldown. You can leap 2 times from the time you hit dash before you're able to dash again. I'll tell you what though, buying the reindeer is a HUGE benefit to moving around the map. With Dash + Armor % speed buff + Quickstep I get up to 22 m/s for short bursts of time which is amazing.
Silverbranch
Member
Yeah my memory said that leap was less than dash, but I couldn't remember for certain, I'm at work operating from memory.
And yeah, in a game of percentage scaling that tiny difference scales ridiculously.
And as cami said, I'm fairly sure the only time I've ever used roar is when sat dicking around waiting for something to happen.
And the only time I've used bite is when trolling guildies by purpling on them with the mount.
And yeah, in a game of percentage scaling that tiny difference scales ridiculously.
And as cami said, I'm fairly sure the only time I've ever used roar is when sat dicking around waiting for something to happen.
And the only time I've used bite is when trolling guildies by purpling on them with the mount.
Wyzpr
Active Member
I have all the discussed mounts.
The Raindeer is not an ideal PvP mount, tho it still gets the job done. Its just fast and the leap makes it very agile. The non-movement skills are barely used, the frost arrow is ok if you hit their mount and have an engage move that works while mounted but is not too hard to counter by them if you dont and the snipe move is only really good damage if you have a bow. Raindeer's best use besides pure speed is for contesting Anth. TBH, without the speed the Raindeer doesnt have much going for it.
Snowlions are better for PvP. Invulndash and stun skill are way more beneficial in these situations.
The Raindeer is not an ideal PvP mount, tho it still gets the job done. Its just fast and the leap makes it very agile. The non-movement skills are barely used, the frost arrow is ok if you hit their mount and have an engage move that works while mounted but is not too hard to counter by them if you dont and the snipe move is only really good damage if you have a bow. Raindeer's best use besides pure speed is for contesting Anth. TBH, without the speed the Raindeer doesnt have much going for it.
Snowlions are better for PvP. Invulndash and stun skill are way more beneficial in these situations.
Silverbranch
Member
That's sort of the entire point of the thread, there's no reason to use anything other than a snowlion (10s) and a reindeer (cash shop)
(And very very very very rarely the leomorph)
Wyzpr
Active Member
Entire point of the thread is to make Thunderdash worthwhile by buffing its speed... Which is fine by me as long as its only a .5 - 1 m/s improvement. Anything more and now the Thunderdash is the only thing everyone wants to use and its the same problem but different object.
I was responding to a comment (which I didn't quote) that mentioned the Raindeer being arguably the best PvP mount, which I disagree with.