What's new

Suggestions

@Lareesha No, they will remain at General Merchant only.
@xkf2 Previously seeds, saplings and animals were mixed. Now they are all listed separately. So, it's much easier for the players now to scroll to the category player is interested in and search there. Regarding them being alphabetized, that will not be possible as game already have 2 languages available and other languages may be added in future.
If you think you can combine seeds, animals and saplings in the better way for players comfort, prepare the list and post in the separate thread for players general discussion. If players will like your option better, we can make a change in listing.

I'm not sure why arguing that alphabetisation is not possible as in the current "systematised" system the items are grouped by GRADE, i.e. BASIC (white) grade SEEDS, GRAND (green) grade SEEDS, RARE (blue) grade SEEDS, ARCANE (purple) grade SEEDS, BASIC grade SAPLINGS... etc
and in those "subcatergories" they are ordered alphabetically anyways...
but that is just a small quibble I guess.

What about addressing the fact that the issues I pointed out, are found ONLY in the Farmer's Merchant Cushion shop.... As in, it does NOT have the systematised listing as for the Seed and Sapling merchant....

I said so in the Edit section at the end of my post...

Edit: after some investigation it seems that this UGLINESS is only in the FARMER'S MERCHANT CUSHION shop

The SEED/SAPLING MERCHANTS standing around are... "fine"
They are still plagued by the issue of
GROUPING BY ITEM GRADE -- WHY? HARDER TO FIND IF YOU DON'T KNOW THE GRADE?????????
and
NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN FARMING v GATHERING seeds,OR LOGGING v GATHERING saplings

Cause honestly it's just silly how the Farmer's Merchant Cushion is NOT mirroring the Seed and Sapling Merchant in game, which I acknowledge is "fine", but, the fact that the two do not have their listings in the same order...

I won't spam you with 10+ screenshots comparing the two but you can go look in game yourself/have other staff look at it.

here is a small example from page 2 of each of the shops respectively:

bSItJUF.png
1566983593552.png


with the non-mirroring repeated throughout...
It seems as though the Farmer's Merchant Cushion was forgotten about when the Seed and Sapling Merchant was systematised...

I would probably be happy with just making the two shops equivalent ("mirroring" one another), rather than changing the list all over again for poor lil' me

But I'll still work on a new "ordering" or "combination" for you...
Cheers.
 

Attachments

  • 1566983593772.png
    1566983593772.png
    526.2 KB · Views: 245
I'm not sure why arguing that alphabetisation is not possible as in the current "systematised" system the items are grouped by GRADE, i.e. BASIC (white) grade SEEDS, GRAND (green) grade SEEDS, RARE (blue) grade SEEDS, ARCANE (purple) grade SEEDS, BASIC grade SAPLINGS... etc
and in those "subcatergories" they are ordered alphabetically anyways...
but that is just a small quibble I guess.

What about addressing the fact that the issues I pointed out, are found ONLY in the Farmer's Merchant Cushion shop.... As in, it does NOT have the systematised listing as for the Seed and Sapling merchant....

I said so in the Edit section at the end of my post...



Cause honestly it's just silly how the Farmer's Merchant Cushion is NOT mirroring the Seed and Sapling Merchant in game, which I acknowledge is "fine", but, the fact that the two do not have their listings in the same order...

I won't spam you with 10+ screenshots comparing the two but you can go look in game yourself/have other staff look at it.

here is a small example from page 2 of each of the shops respectively:

bSItJUF.png
View attachment 8441

with the non-mirroring repeated throughout...
It seems as though the Farmer's Merchant Cushion was forgotten about when the Seed and Sapling Merchant was systematised...

I would probably be happy with just making the two shops equivalent ("mirroring" one another), rather than changing the list all over again for poor lil' me

But I'll still work on a new "ordering" or "combination" for you...
Cheers.
I didn't say making the further change in the order is not possible. Please check my previous reply. You can provide your list for in the separate thread for players general discussion.

But alphabetizing it for everybody will not be possible as right now we have 2 language options and some words may sound in different way, so would have a completely different order if we make it alphabetized. So only 1 language may actually have it completely alphabetized and it will be impossible for both.
 
I didn't say making the further change in the order is not possible. Please check my previous reply. You can provide your list for in the separate thread for players general discussion.

But alphabetizing it for everybody will not be possible as right now we have 2 language options and some words may sound in different way, so would have a completely different order if we make it alphabetized. So only 1 language may actually have it completely alphabetized and it will be impossible for both.

Okay, I understand why alphabetisation is impossible across different languages. Thank you for explaining.
However, you cannot say that you DON'T do it for English, since, in the current implementation of the systematised Seed and Sapling Merchant they are alphabetised within such subcategories.
I already said that this is okay, and I already said that I would be making a separate post.

But, you still haven't addressed my main complaint:

What of the FARMER'S MERCHANT CUSHION being DIFFERENT from the SEED AND SAPLING MERCHANT?
Please go back and read my post(s) as well.
 
Okay, I understand why alphabetisation is impossible across different languages. Thank you for explaining.
However, you cannot say that you DON'T do it for English, since, in the current implementation of the systematised Seed and Sapling Merchant they are alphabetised within such subcategories.
I already said that this is okay, and I already said that I would be making a separate post.

But, you still haven't addressed my main complaint:

What of the FARMER'S MERCHANT CUSHION being DIFFERENT from the SEED AND SAPLING MERCHANT?
Please go back and read my post(s) as well.

If you don't like how it's listed, you can offer your list as well.
 
If you don't like how it's listed, you can offer your list as well.

Yes I know. But first:
The FARMER MERCHANT CUSHION shop order, does not match the SEED and SAPLING MERCHANT shop order in game.
LOOK IN GAME.

I don't have to suggest my own list if you can make the shops match order! :p See these examples:



LEFT is MERCHANT CUSHION | RIGHT is SEED AND SAPLING MERCHANT


P.S. Sorry for spamming thread.
 
As I said before, if you don't like what order items are listed at Seed and Sapling Merchant or Cushion, feel free to provide your own list and we'll have it discussed with the Devs.
 
He wants both merchants to have the same arrangement of seeds & saplings. They are different now.
Merchant's Cushion Page 1 doesn't show the same items as a Seed Merchants Page 1.
 
Is it possible to get the Daily Schedule's Event tab updated to the server's actual times for the Server Time events?
1567034897213.png
As of right now, the only one that is consistent with the schedule (that I'm aware) is Mistmerrow.
The current actual schedule is as follows (once again that I am aware of. Not sure of the siege and the fish fest times) :
  • Ocleera occurs at midnight(0:00) and noon(12:00)
  • Abyssal Attack (Tue/Th/Sa) occurs at 18:30
  • Lusca Awakening occurs at 19:00
Additionally, is it possible to add the daily custom events (the one I'm thinking the most of is Hasla Zombie Rift) to the schedule?

Also, can you add the current server time to the bottom of the Event tab like it is on the Login Tracker tab?
1567035076850.png

On the topic of Hasla Zombie Rift, is it possible to make it so the infantrymen the commanders summon to count towards the quest progress? CR allows for this with their commander summons.
 
Is it possible to get the Daily Schedule's Event tab updated to the server's actual times for the Server Time events?
View attachment 8449
As of right now, the only one that is consistent with the schedule (that I'm aware) is Mistmerrow.
The current actual schedule is as follows (once again that I am aware of. Not sure of the siege and the fish fest times) :
  • Ocleera occurs at midnight(0:00) and noon(12:00)
  • Abyssal Attack (Tue/Th/Sa) occurs at 18:30
  • Lusca Awakening occurs at 19:00
Additionally, is it possible to add the daily custom events (the one I'm thinking the most of is Hasla Zombie Rift) to the schedule?

Also, can you add the current server time to the bottom of the Event tab like it is on the Login Tracker tab?
View attachment 8450

On the topic of Hasla Zombie Rift, is it possible to make it so the infantrymen the commanders summon to count towards the quest progress? CR allows for this with their commander summons.

Time you provide for the events is not correct for all as well.
All the correct events time can be found in THIS thread.

We'll have information corrected in the ingame table for the events that have wrong timing mentioned there, but for now you can use the thread provided above as it has the correct events data.

Regarding the Hasla Zombie Rift quest counts, that is intentional and working in the correct way. Will not be changed.
 
Time you provide for the events is not correct for all as well.
All the correct events time can be found in THIS thread.

We'll have information corrected in the ingame table for the events that have wrong timing mentioned there, but for now you can use the thread provided above as it has the correct events data.
I see what I did to the times. I accidentally converted it to my personal time. Thank you for looking into fixing them ingame!
 
Introduction

Today, I feel the exploration system is not really rewarded as it should. Increasing exploration mainly rely on recovery pouch instead of actual in-game work. Itself, the exploration is not a lucrative work either before levels where sunken ships can be recovered.

My idea is to propose a way to spend more labor in the early game and late game of the exploration, with a better reward system. The idea behind that could also motivate more naval wars.



Background Lore

Long ago, mercenary boats sailed on the seas, known as the "Golden Fleet". These boats were the property of a powerful man who was respected from both Nuian and Hanaris. No matter where they were on seas, people respected them as they feared them.

For this reason, they were selected to be the transporters of rare and valuables goods, which they made money from by protecting them along the way. Decades passed and even when pirates fought them, even when they lost ships, all the goods they transported arrived where it should. Up to one day...

A mystic sect called "The Reliquary" boat their services to move mysterious packs. Where were they moving? Nobody knows, but the boat never arrived where they should.


Today, The Reliquary members keep tracking any sign of what belongs to them, as they know the powerful lost artifacts may be misused in bad hands. It is not clear where they get all their money from, but a thing is clear: If you find anything related to the lost cargo, they will be ready to give you good money for it.

And for a good reason: These artifacts are former possessions of Dahuta. Who has them may unleash dangerous horrors in the world...


Mechanics
Sunken treasure chests have a chance (~20%) to drop a "Ghost memory" (10 silvers). This item requires a sextant to be used and will provide a position to go in the ocean. There, it can be activated to find a "Lost Reliquary pack" underwater.

Up to this point, there are 2 possibilities :
- Either return the pack to a Relic Merchant. 20g paid directly in base continents, 27g in Auroria, 35g in Friedrich.
- Either bring it to a member of the Reliquary (located in Diamond Shore, Solzreed, Two Crown, Solis and Villanelle) who will exchange them for 5g and provide a "Reliquary Recovery Stone", available for 6h. This has to be used on the former position of the Lost Reliquary Pack and cost 100 labors.


There, a new pack will spawn underwater (Ghost Reliquary Pack). This pack can be either sold to a Relic Merchant (40/54/70) or returned to a Reliquary Member.
In this case, 10g will be provided, with a "Reliquary Recognition Token" and an "Estimated Cargo Position". The "Estimated Cargo Position" is available for a week and provides a new destination (still in the seas).

There, it is possible to discover 3-5 treasure chest hidden under the sand, which shows bubble just like a sunken ship (just activate using F to discover them by spending 200 labors exploration). The treasure chest contains a "Rare Reliquary Pack", with "Reliquary Crate" which require a Reliquary key to be opened (see tokens). Content of the crate is displayed below and includes Dahuta's light Fragment (see details below).

The Rare reliquary packs can be either sold to a Relic Merchant (75/90/115) or returned to Relicary Member (20g rewards and 5 tokens)

Regarding the Dahuta's light Fragment: With 10 combined (100labors, exploration), the light can be either given to a Relicary Member, for 100g and 10 tokens or used overseas, necessary in a nonpeaceful area.

A message is sent to all players (just like when Delphinad ship is destroyed). 10 waves of lusca will spawn, 1 wave every 7 minutes. The light provides a buff to all members in the raid, Reducing damages from creatures of the sea by 50%. Once the wave ends, another wave could be added to increase rewards.

Sunken ships recovered by the exploration may also contain Reliquary Packs.

What the Reliquary Tokens could be used for (underlined part required for the mechanic, others are just ideas):
- Reliquary keys, 15 tokens (Untradable, used to open Reliquary Crate for 100 labors, exploration)
- Reliquary Defiance, 25 tokens (Feet, plate armor, Increase swim speed by +50%)
- Reliquary Blessing, 100 tokens (Neckless, Agility 2, activation buff: Increase swim speed of +20% for 5 sec, 2min cooldown)
- Dahuta's blow, 100 tokens (A glider bound once equipped with an ability to be invulnerable to sea wind for 1min when used, 5min recovery).
- Reliquary Breathing Device Design, 200 tokens (Charge time 60s, Base breathing time 20min, swim speed increase +35%)
- Reliquary Dive Helmet, 60 tokens (Head, plate armor, Allow you to breath 2 minutes longer underwater)
- Reliquary Compass Design, 500 tokens (Can be equipped on merchant schooners, small and medium warships, and destroyers). Display ships and drydocks on the map, with an added ability: detect shipwreck (1 use/5min).

Content of the Reliquary Crates (rates impacted by exploration proficiency):
- 50s to 1g (100% chance)
- Red/Blue/Green Archeum Dust (75% chance)
- Reliquary lost book (sold 2g, 20% chance)
- Dahuta's secret history book (sold 5g, 10% chance)
- Reliquary secret history (sold 20g, 5% chance)
- Dahuta's light Fragment (untradable, 5% chance. See mechanics details)


Ideas behind the scenario proposed:
- Implementing Reliquary system would push people into exploration if the reward is worth the risks.
- The Dahuta's Light generates multiple Luscas spawn which can value this system for the Enoan blueprint. Even if the first waves should not be that hard to control, it becomes far more complicated after tens of minutes when other PVP ships are coming to hunt your luscas (and you!).
- Other rewards from the Reliquary may diversify the possibilities of this system, as people would be able to monetize their work.
- Keys are sent untradable, to make the Dahuta's light creation harder. This "path" should be taken mainly to increase the possibility to make the Enoan, as the other helps to make money (like Commerce, but with a stronger risk since necessary in the sea).
- As the pack rank increases in the process, the choice between "making money" or "go to the light" should be even harder to make, creating more opportunities for players.
- The choice of setting a Reliquary Member into Vilanelle is to support the Haranian side: With Solis being on the south of the map, it makes otherwise more movement required from Haranian to reach the Reliquary if they are sent in the Arcadian sea.
- With the packs available in the sunken ships too, it makes even more interesting to look for sunken ships once possible.
- This new system requires some coding, but no extra work based on graphics as previous design could be recycled here.
- By creating a more viable farming of gold with exploration, increasing this proficiency would make more sense. (However, this is an opinion, since the

Questions to be addressed (and personal opinion of the author)
- Make the Dahuta's light tradable? Could be sold on the market or given to other players once finished.
- Make the keys tradable (or the Dahut'as light Fragments) could increase the potential value acquired by the explorers but highly simplify the rush of Enoan. I personally do not support this idea (this is the biggest boat, I think it should remain a challenge to get it even if this system does help to get it).
- Setting a minimal quantity of Reliquary Packs in the sunken ship boat to support this system? This would help higher proficiency level to keep working with the Reliquary system.
- Provide merit stars/vocation badges/gilda once a day to push people into exploration if they bring back a Reliquary pack? I personally think the rewards are sufficient enough this way.
- Only 1 light can be used at the time in the world? This would lead to more PVP... but could also remove the strategy possibilities to voluntary start another one in another area to split potential pirates.
- Give a message to nearby people when the treasure chests are recovered? This would lead to more risks... as nearby pirates could be tempted to take them.
- In the case of the Reliquary Compass, should we only display wreckship always (and then no other ships) or keep as proposed? I think having the compass showing shipwreck overtime would be too much, even more, when the drawback can be overcome with another boat.
- Adding an extra boss at the end, like another spawn of the Kraken? This might make the system too interesting, even if the Light would probably not appear every week either. Still, this could increase the "pirate" affluence to the area.
- Instead of Vilanelle, maybe use Ynystere to find another member of the Reliquary? This is an idea. However, since Ynystere can be a conflicted territory, I did not find this idea to be the most "fair" for this side. Maybe adding a member of the Reliquary to all point where there is a Cargo buyer could be another alternative.
- Why not just adding more shipwreck in the sea? I personnally think this would lack coherence. Having a sea full of wreck is not really pleasant to see and the actual dispersion is fine enough. Increasing rewards seems to me a better option.
- What about the pirates? Adding a reliquary on their island sounds a bit incoherent with the lore... But this could also be a way for them to pay back their infamy. Just an idea, I didn't think much about this part of the game I'm not familiar enough with.
- Why would we play with an exploration more lucrative when safe commmerce on continent is lucrative enough ? I think it only provides more opportunity for players, even if commerce is powerful enough to make money.
- Could we increase the number of packs found to push the player to by an additionnal pack place for a clipper/a speed boat/a shooner ? I really like the idea, but the question which is next is all about balencing. I am affraid this system, even if it makes more risks for the player (can be easily detected by the other boats, risks to pay the shattigon sand to repair, etc...) it means also more rewards. Following this idea, it could be possible to reduce the price offered by the Reliquary and Merchant for each pack.
- Consider more tokens and gold for a packet delivered to the Reliquary on Friedrich ? I would say I like this idea, but I tried to keep simple a system which is already complex enough here.
- Adding a token at each pack returned ? I like this idea too. As shown in the maths below, the value of a token is approximately 23s (based on the Dahuta's light returned). Adding 1 of them in the first step and maybe 2 on the second (or 3) may not do a great difference from a gold aspect but could support risky behavior to keep running the Reliquary task. As a drawback, this makes easier to collect the crates obtained (and thus, the Dahuta's light).

The maths behind it
The following data have been gathered empirically. They may not reflect the exact reality despite all efforts put into it. They also lack on the Haranian side. Any help acquired to improve the data about the actual game is welcome. All computations details are available from the python notebook attached.

The purpose was to compare the rewards obtained through commerce and compare them with exploration. Based on these statistics, different rewards can be established to balance the system.

If we consider the classical trade run Gwenoid forest to Solzreed (one of the most done from what I could see ingame), we estimate at 10.63h the time required to gather enough gold from the farm cart to the farm wagon. From this point, 4.95h are required to go to the hauler, 3.48h more to go to the freighter and 22.93 to get the costume. Voluntary, commerce has been computed to minimize results (since all packs are not at 130% all the time, price is decreased to 13g)

In comparison, getting the submarine with the schooner required for the expedition is 8 times more than all the previous added (349.42h)... but we can understand this comparison is not fair and does not bring much. Commerce is made to be lucrative and even if this proposition is thought to make exploration a bit more, we can keep this ratio under the commerce efficiency. Still, today exploration is not really made as it is not lucrative before the shooner and the submarine. This path tend to propose another way to proceed, giving more possibilities to reach this point, with maybe even more player "interactions" (=PVP)

As an average of 5.54 chests per hour, the exploration brings today an average of 11.23 gold per hour (computed over 72h of pure exploration with multiple people). We can compare this to the hourly profits of the different cart in the trade run :

- Hourly profit for farm cart: 89.14
- Hourly profit for farm wagon: 155.19
- Hourly profit for farm hauler: 221.24
- Hourly profit for farm freighter: 287.29
- Hourly profit for farm freighter with costume: 431.67

With a ratio of 0.2% drop rate for the "Ghost Memory" item and 5 chests/hour on average, we can estimate 1 memory/hour. The rest is established with the Reliquary runs.
As we can consider most of the packs returned on the continent for safety reason (we compare the safe trade runs, so we examine the safest estimation first). This means 20g for the run. With the sea cover, let's consider an arbitrary 20minutes (low estimation) to reach the pack, and 20 min to deliver it. This makes only 23.7433g with the additionnal classical 20min, but already double the hourly profits of the explorers... and this also remains approximately 4 times less than the lowest commerce cart (24g vs 89g).

If the character wishes to earn more with the Reliquary, its profits are decreased to 5g+20 min at 11.23g. This makes an expectation of 8.7433g for the first hour.
The next hour is considered as only hunting the Reliquary second packs, within 40 minutes.

This leads to either 40g by selling, and restarting the process at the rate of 11.23g for the 20 min remaining (43.7433g of this hour, still half of the basic farm cart).

Taking this into consideration, we can establish the following incomes rates based on "Reliquary" or "Merchant". Please note that everytime the player select option "merchant", he restarts his expectation:

ktNijHq.png


Considering the prices in AH, we obtained an average value of 3.4433g/crate opened (which requires previous runs for the Reliquary). From this point, we obtain the value of around 23s/token obtained working for the Reliquary. Last hour is not considered entirely (about what goes in the remaining minutes, since travel time can be highly variable).

We see this system tends to remain less lucrative than the "safe" commerce system, except when taking very high risks in comparison.
 

Attachments

  • Archerage Exploration comparison.zip
    3.5 KB · Views: 275
hey


I have an idea to implement in path 4.0 that is part of path 4.5
Skills Migration
With Patch 4.5, you changed Skill Migration to include three different sets to reproduce different build styles. With this new feature, players can switch between their three custom sets of migrated statistics at any time, displaying the most fluid class switches and allowing players to transpire without harming their experience or statistics.

Who can I talk to to implement this idea i play DR and mage I need to migrate the status to 1 of the classes that gets in the way of my damage, and also that 1 class gets weaker with the other so unable to play with 2 different classes
 

Attachments

  • skk.png
    skk.png
    155.2 KB · Views: 229
hey


I have an idea to implement in path 4.0 that is part of path 4.5
Skills Migration
With Patch 4.5, you changed Skill Migration to include three different sets to reproduce different build styles. With this new feature, players can switch between their three custom sets of migrated statistics at any time, displaying the most fluid class switches and allowing players to transpire without harming their experience or statistics.

Who can I talk to to implement this idea i play DR and mage I need to migrate the status to 1 of the classes that gets in the way of my damage, and also that 1 class gets weaker with the other so unable to play with 2 different classes
Changes from future patches are left until that future patch. Otherwise it causes complications and problems when updating to said patch
 
Introduction

Today, I feel the exploration system is not really rewarded as it should. Increasing exploration mainly rely on recovery pouch instead of actual in-game work. Itself, the exploration is not a lucrative work either before levels where sunken ships can be recovered.

My idea is to propose a way to spend more labor in the early game and late game of the exploration, with a better reward system. The idea behind that could also motivate more naval wars.



Background Lore

Long ago, mercenary boats sailed on the seas, known as the "Golden Fleet". These boats were the property of a powerful man who was respected from both Nuian and Hanaris. No matter where they were on seas, people respected them as they feared them.

For this reason, they were selected to be the transporters of rare and valuables goods, which they made money from by protecting them along the way. Decades passed and even when pirates fought them, even when they lost ships, all the goods they transported arrived where it should. Up to one day...

A mystic sect called "The Reliquary" boat their services to move mysterious packs. Where were they moving? Nobody knows, but the boat never arrived where they should.


Today, The Reliquary members keep tracking any sign of what belongs to them, as they know the powerful lost artifacts may be misused in bad hands. It is not clear where they get all their money from, but a thing is clear: If you find anything related to the lost cargo, they will be ready to give you good money for it.

And for a good reason: These artifacts are former possessions of Dahuta. Who has them may unleash dangerous horrors in the world...


Mechanics
Sunken treasure chests have a chance (~20%) to drop a "Ghost memory" (10 silvers). This item requires a sextant to be used and will provide a position to go in the ocean. There, it can be activated to find a "Lost Reliquary pack" underwater.

Up to this point, there are 2 possibilities :
- Either return the pack to a Relic Merchant. 20g paid directly in base continents, 27g in Auroria, 35g in Friedrich.
- Either bring it to a member of the Reliquary (located in Diamond Shore, Solzreed, Two Crown, Solis and Villanelle) who will exchange them for 5g and provide a "Reliquary Recovery Stone", available for 6h. This has to be used on the former position of the Lost Reliquary Pack and cost 100 labors.


There, a new pack will spawn underwater (Ghost Reliquary Pack). This pack can be either sold to a Relic Merchant (40/54/70) or returned to a Reliquary Member.
In this case, 10g will be provided, with a "Reliquary Recognition Token" and an "Estimated Cargo Position". The "Estimated Cargo Position" is available for a week and provides a new destination (still in the seas).

There, it is possible to discover 3-5 treasure chest hidden under the sand, which shows bubble just like a sunken ship (just activate using F to discover them by spending 200 labors exploration). The treasure chest contains a "Rare Reliquary Pack", with "Reliquary Crate" which require a Reliquary key to be opened (see tokens). Content of the crate is displayed below and includes Dahuta's light Fragment (see details below).

The Rare reliquary packs can be either sold to a Relic Merchant (75/90/115) or returned to Relicary Member (20g rewards and 5 tokens)

Regarding the Dahuta's light Fragment: With 10 combined (100labors, exploration), the light can be either given to a Relicary Member, for 100g and 10 tokens or used overseas, necessary in a nonpeaceful area.

A message is sent to all players (just like when Delphinad ship is destroyed). 10 waves of lusca will spawn, 1 wave every 7 minutes. The light provides a buff to all members in the raid, Reducing damages from creatures of the sea by 50%. Once the wave ends, another wave could be added to increase rewards.

Sunken ships recovered by the exploration may also contain Reliquary Packs.

What the Reliquary Tokens could be used for (underlined part required for the mechanic, others are just ideas):
- Reliquary keys, 15 tokens (Untradable, used to open Reliquary Crate for 100 labors, exploration)
- Reliquary Defiance, 25 tokens (Feet, plate armor, Increase swim speed by +50%)
- Reliquary Blessing, 100 tokens (Neckless, Agility 2, activation buff: Increase swim speed of +20% for 5 sec, 2min cooldown)
- Dahuta's blow, 100 tokens (A glider bound once equipped with an ability to be invulnerable to sea wind for 1min when used, 5min recovery).
- Reliquary Breathing Device Design, 200 tokens (Charge time 60s, Base breathing time 20min, swim speed increase +35%)
- Reliquary Dive Helmet, 60 tokens (Head, plate armor, Allow you to breath 2 minutes longer underwater)
- Reliquary Compass Design, 500 tokens (Can be equipped on merchant schooners, small and medium warships, and destroyers). Display ships and drydocks on the map, with an added ability: detect shipwreck (1 use/5min).

Content of the Reliquary Crates (rates impacted by exploration proficiency):
- 50s to 1g (100% chance)
- Red/Blue/Green Archeum Dust (75% chance)
- Reliquary lost book (sold 2g, 20% chance)
- Dahuta's secret history book (sold 5g, 10% chance)
- Reliquary secret history (sold 20g, 5% chance)
- Dahuta's light Fragment (untradable, 5% chance. See mechanics details)


Ideas behind the scenario proposed:
- Implementing Reliquary system would push people into exploration if the reward is worth the risks.
- The Dahuta's Light generates multiple Luscas spawn which can value this system for the Enoan blueprint. Even if the first waves should not be that hard to control, it becomes far more complicated after tens of minutes when other PVP ships are coming to hunt your luscas (and you!).
- Other rewards from the Reliquary may diversify the possibilities of this system, as people would be able to monetize their work.
- Keys are sent untradable, to make the Dahuta's light creation harder. This "path" should be taken mainly to increase the possibility to make the Enoan, as the other helps to make money (like Commerce, but with a stronger risk since necessary in the sea).
- As the pack rank increases in the process, the choice between "making money" or "go to the light" should be even harder to make, creating more opportunities for players.
- The choice of setting a Reliquary Member into Vilanelle is to support the Haranian side: With Solis being on the south of the map, it makes otherwise more movement required from Haranian to reach the Reliquary if they are sent in the Arcadian sea.
- With the packs available in the sunken ships too, it makes even more interesting to look for sunken ships once possible.
- This new system requires some coding, but no extra work based on graphics as previous design could be recycled here.
- By creating a more viable farming of gold with exploration, increasing this proficiency would make more sense. (However, this is an opinion, since the

Questions to be addressed (and personal opinion of the author)
- Make the Dahuta's light tradable? Could be sold on the market or given to other players once finished.
- Make the keys tradable (or the Dahut'as light Fragments) could increase the potential value acquired by the explorers but highly simplify the rush of Enoan. I personally do not support this idea (this is the biggest boat, I think it should remain a challenge to get it even if this system does help to get it).
- Setting a minimal quantity of Reliquary Packs in the sunken ship boat to support this system? This would help higher proficiency level to keep working with the Reliquary system.
- Provide merit stars/vocation badges/gilda once a day to push people into exploration if they bring back a Reliquary pack? I personally think the rewards are sufficient enough this way.
- Only 1 light can be used at the time in the world? This would lead to more PVP... but could also remove the strategy possibilities to voluntary start another one in another area to split potential pirates.
- Give a message to nearby people when the treasure chests are recovered? This would lead to more risks... as nearby pirates could be tempted to take them.
- In the case of the Reliquary Compass, should we only display wreckship always (and then no other ships) or keep as proposed? I think having the compass showing shipwreck overtime would be too much, even more, when the drawback can be overcome with another boat.
- Adding an extra boss at the end, like another spawn of the Kraken? This might make the system too interesting, even if the Light would probably not appear every week either. Still, this could increase the "pirate" affluence to the area.
- Instead of Vilanelle, maybe use Ynystere to find another member of the Reliquary? This is an idea. However, since Ynystere can be a conflicted territory, I did not find this idea to be the most "fair" for this side. Maybe adding a member of the Reliquary to all point where there is a Cargo buyer could be another alternative.
- Why not just adding more shipwreck in the sea? I personnally think this would lack coherence. Having a sea full of wreck is not really pleasant to see and the actual dispersion is fine enough. Increasing rewards seems to me a better option.
- What about the pirates? Adding a reliquary on their island sounds a bit incoherent with the lore... But this could also be a way for them to pay back their infamy. Just an idea, I didn't think much about this part of the game I'm not familiar enough with.
- Why would we play with an exploration more lucrative when safe commmerce on continent is lucrative enough ? I think it only provides more opportunity for players, even if commerce is powerful enough to make money.
- Could we increase the number of packs found to push the player to by an additionnal pack place for a clipper/a speed boat/a shooner ? I really like the idea, but the question which is next is all about balencing. I am affraid this system, even if it makes more risks for the player (can be easily detected by the other boats, risks to pay the shattigon sand to repair, etc...) it means also more rewards. Following this idea, it could be possible to reduce the price offered by the Reliquary and Merchant for each pack.
- Consider more tokens and gold for a packet delivered to the Reliquary on Friedrich ? I would say I like this idea, but I tried to keep simple a system which is already complex enough here.
- Adding a token at each pack returned ? I like this idea too. As shown in the maths below, the value of a token is approximately 23s (based on the Dahuta's light returned). Adding 1 of them in the first step and maybe 2 on the second (or 3) may not do a great difference from a gold aspect but could support risky behavior to keep running the Reliquary task. As a drawback, this makes easier to collect the crates obtained (and thus, the Dahuta's light).

The maths behind it
The following data have been gathered empirically. They may not reflect the exact reality despite all efforts put into it. They also lack on the Haranian side. Any help acquired to improve the data about the actual game is welcome. All computations details are available from the python notebook attached.

The purpose was to compare the rewards obtained through commerce and compare them with exploration. Based on these statistics, different rewards can be established to balance the system.

If we consider the classical trade run Gwenoid forest to Solzreed (one of the most done from what I could see ingame), we estimate at 10.63h the time required to gather enough gold from the farm cart to the farm wagon. From this point, 4.95h are required to go to the hauler, 3.48h more to go to the freighter and 22.93 to get the costume. Voluntary, commerce has been computed to minimize results (since all packs are not at 130% all the time, price is decreased to 13g)

In comparison, getting the submarine with the schooner required for the expedition is 8 times more than all the previous added (349.42h)... but we can understand this comparison is not fair and does not bring much. Commerce is made to be lucrative and even if this proposition is thought to make exploration a bit more, we can keep this ratio under the commerce efficiency. Still, today exploration is not really made as it is not lucrative before the shooner and the submarine. This path tend to propose another way to proceed, giving more possibilities to reach this point, with maybe even more player "interactions" (=PVP)

As an average of 5.54 chests per hour, the exploration brings today an average of 11.23 gold per hour (computed over 72h of pure exploration with multiple people). We can compare this to the hourly profits of the different cart in the trade run :

- Hourly profit for farm cart: 89.14
- Hourly profit for farm wagon: 155.19
- Hourly profit for farm hauler: 221.24
- Hourly profit for farm freighter: 287.29
- Hourly profit for farm freighter with costume: 431.67

With a ratio of 0.2% drop rate for the "Ghost Memory" item and 5 chests/hour on average, we can estimate 1 memory/hour. The rest is established with the Reliquary runs.
As we can consider most of the packs returned on the continent for safety reason (we compare the safe trade runs, so we examine the safest estimation first). This means 20g for the run. With the sea cover, let's consider an arbitrary 20minutes (low estimation) to reach the pack, and 20 min to deliver it. This makes only 23.7433g with the additionnal classical 20min, but already double the hourly profits of the explorers... and this also remains approximately 4 times less than the lowest commerce cart (24g vs 89g).

If the character wishes to earn more with the Reliquary, its profits are decreased to 5g+20 min at 11.23g. This makes an expectation of 8.7433g for the first hour.
The next hour is considered as only hunting the Reliquary second packs, within 40 minutes.

This leads to either 40g by selling, and restarting the process at the rate of 11.23g for the 20 min remaining (43.7433g of this hour, still half of the basic farm cart).

Taking this into consideration, we can establish the following incomes rates based on "Reliquary" or "Merchant". Please note that everytime the player select option "merchant", he restarts his expectation:

ktNijHq.png


Considering the prices in AH, we obtained an average value of 3.4433g/crate opened (which requires previous runs for the Reliquary). From this point, we obtain the value of around 23s/token obtained working for the Reliquary. Last hour is not considered entirely (about what goes in the remaining minutes, since travel time can be highly variable).

We see this system tends to remain less lucrative than the "safe" commerce system, except when taking very high risks in comparison.

any tl:dr? o_O
 
As I said before, if you don't like what order items are listed at Seed and Sapling Merchant or Cushion, feel free to provide your own list and we'll have it discussed with the Devs.

he's saying it's not the same xD he just asks if they can be the same :x
 
Can you give me the examples of both cases?
I can tell you one example from Orig game - so is likely the same here: Ordinary tradepacks always replace glider (like specialty, cheese, that stuff) but things like the Archeum packs for Guild Quests always DO NOT replace glider.
 
Perdita Statue needs to be worth more then 10g. Maybe 100g. Its not even worth turning in at this price.
It was made such low profit at a reason and we don't think that increasing it to 100g is a good idea.

I can tell you one example from Orig game - so is likely the same here: Ordinary tradepacks always replace glider (like specialty, cheese, that stuff) but things like the Archeum packs for Guild Quests always DO NOT replace glider.
Thank you for the details.

An option to save gearsets and change them in one go
Will not be possible at this stage. Also can result to having it abused in the way to crash other players with slow PCs.

Introduction

Today, I feel the exploration system is not really rewarded as it should. Increasing exploration mainly rely on recovery pouch instead of actual in-game work. Itself, the exploration is not a lucrative work either before levels where sunken ships can be recovered.

My idea is to propose a way to spend more labor in the early game and late game of the exploration, with a better reward system. The idea behind that could also motivate more naval wars.



Background Lore

Long ago, mercenary boats sailed on the seas, known as the "Golden Fleet". These boats were the property of a powerful man who was respected from both Nuian and Hanaris. No matter where they were on seas, people respected them as they feared them.

For this reason, they were selected to be the transporters of rare and valuables goods, which they made money from by protecting them along the way. Decades passed and even when pirates fought them, even when they lost ships, all the goods they transported arrived where it should. Up to one day...

A mystic sect called "The Reliquary" boat their services to move mysterious packs. Where were they moving? Nobody knows, but the boat never arrived where they should.


Today, The Reliquary members keep tracking any sign of what belongs to them, as they know the powerful lost artifacts may be misused in bad hands. It is not clear where they get all their money from, but a thing is clear: If you find anything related to the lost cargo, they will be ready to give you good money for it.

And for a good reason: These artifacts are former possessions of Dahuta. Who has them may unleash dangerous horrors in the world...


Mechanics
Sunken treasure chests have a chance (~20%) to drop a "Ghost memory" (10 silvers). This item requires a sextant to be used and will provide a position to go in the ocean. There, it can be activated to find a "Lost Reliquary pack" underwater.

Up to this point, there are 2 possibilities :
- Either return the pack to a Relic Merchant. 20g paid directly in base continents, 27g in Auroria, 35g in Friedrich.
- Either bring it to a member of the Reliquary (located in Diamond Shore, Solzreed, Two Crown, Solis and Villanelle) who will exchange them for 5g and provide a "Reliquary Recovery Stone", available for 6h. This has to be used on the former position of the Lost Reliquary Pack and cost 100 labors.


There, a new pack will spawn underwater (Ghost Reliquary Pack). This pack can be either sold to a Relic Merchant (40/54/70) or returned to a Reliquary Member.
In this case, 10g will be provided, with a "Reliquary Recognition Token" and an "Estimated Cargo Position". The "Estimated Cargo Position" is available for a week and provides a new destination (still in the seas).

There, it is possible to discover 3-5 treasure chest hidden under the sand, which shows bubble just like a sunken ship (just activate using F to discover them by spending 200 labors exploration). The treasure chest contains a "Rare Reliquary Pack", with "Reliquary Crate" which require a Reliquary key to be opened (see tokens). Content of the crate is displayed below and includes Dahuta's light Fragment (see details below).

The Rare reliquary packs can be either sold to a Relic Merchant (75/90/115) or returned to Relicary Member (20g rewards and 5 tokens)

Regarding the Dahuta's light Fragment: With 10 combined (100labors, exploration), the light can be either given to a Relicary Member, for 100g and 10 tokens or used overseas, necessary in a nonpeaceful area.

A message is sent to all players (just like when Delphinad ship is destroyed). 10 waves of lusca will spawn, 1 wave every 7 minutes. The light provides a buff to all members in the raid, Reducing damages from creatures of the sea by 50%. Once the wave ends, another wave could be added to increase rewards.

Sunken ships recovered by the exploration may also contain Reliquary Packs.

What the Reliquary Tokens could be used for (underlined part required for the mechanic, others are just ideas):
- Reliquary keys, 15 tokens (Untradable, used to open Reliquary Crate for 100 labors, exploration)
- Reliquary Defiance, 25 tokens (Feet, plate armor, Increase swim speed by +50%)
- Reliquary Blessing, 100 tokens (Neckless, Agility 2, activation buff: Increase swim speed of +20% for 5 sec, 2min cooldown)
- Dahuta's blow, 100 tokens (A glider bound once equipped with an ability to be invulnerable to sea wind for 1min when used, 5min recovery).
- Reliquary Breathing Device Design, 200 tokens (Charge time 60s, Base breathing time 20min, swim speed increase +35%)
- Reliquary Dive Helmet, 60 tokens (Head, plate armor, Allow you to breath 2 minutes longer underwater)
- Reliquary Compass Design, 500 tokens (Can be equipped on merchant schooners, small and medium warships, and destroyers). Display ships and drydocks on the map, with an added ability: detect shipwreck (1 use/5min).

Content of the Reliquary Crates (rates impacted by exploration proficiency):
- 50s to 1g (100% chance)
- Red/Blue/Green Archeum Dust (75% chance)
- Reliquary lost book (sold 2g, 20% chance)
- Dahuta's secret history book (sold 5g, 10% chance)
- Reliquary secret history (sold 20g, 5% chance)
- Dahuta's light Fragment (untradable, 5% chance. See mechanics details)


Ideas behind the scenario proposed:
- Implementing Reliquary system would push people into exploration if the reward is worth the risks.
- The Dahuta's Light generates multiple Luscas spawn which can value this system for the Enoan blueprint. Even if the first waves should not be that hard to control, it becomes far more complicated after tens of minutes when other PVP ships are coming to hunt your luscas (and you!).
- Other rewards from the Reliquary may diversify the possibilities of this system, as people would be able to monetize their work.
- Keys are sent untradable, to make the Dahuta's light creation harder. This "path" should be taken mainly to increase the possibility to make the Enoan, as the other helps to make money (like Commerce, but with a stronger risk since necessary in the sea).
- As the pack rank increases in the process, the choice between "making money" or "go to the light" should be even harder to make, creating more opportunities for players.
- The choice of setting a Reliquary Member into Vilanelle is to support the Haranian side: With Solis being on the south of the map, it makes otherwise more movement required from Haranian to reach the Reliquary if they are sent in the Arcadian sea.
- With the packs available in the sunken ships too, it makes even more interesting to look for sunken ships once possible.
- This new system requires some coding, but no extra work based on graphics as previous design could be recycled here.
- By creating a more viable farming of gold with exploration, increasing this proficiency would make more sense. (However, this is an opinion, since the

Questions to be addressed (and personal opinion of the author)
- Make the Dahuta's light tradable? Could be sold on the market or given to other players once finished.
- Make the keys tradable (or the Dahut'as light Fragments) could increase the potential value acquired by the explorers but highly simplify the rush of Enoan. I personally do not support this idea (this is the biggest boat, I think it should remain a challenge to get it even if this system does help to get it).
- Setting a minimal quantity of Reliquary Packs in the sunken ship boat to support this system? This would help higher proficiency level to keep working with the Reliquary system.
- Provide merit stars/vocation badges/gilda once a day to push people into exploration if they bring back a Reliquary pack? I personally think the rewards are sufficient enough this way.
- Only 1 light can be used at the time in the world? This would lead to more PVP... but could also remove the strategy possibilities to voluntary start another one in another area to split potential pirates.
- Give a message to nearby people when the treasure chests are recovered? This would lead to more risks... as nearby pirates could be tempted to take them.
- In the case of the Reliquary Compass, should we only display wreckship always (and then no other ships) or keep as proposed? I think having the compass showing shipwreck overtime would be too much, even more, when the drawback can be overcome with another boat.
- Adding an extra boss at the end, like another spawn of the Kraken? This might make the system too interesting, even if the Light would probably not appear every week either. Still, this could increase the "pirate" affluence to the area.
- Instead of Vilanelle, maybe use Ynystere to find another member of the Reliquary? This is an idea. However, since Ynystere can be a conflicted territory, I did not find this idea to be the most "fair" for this side. Maybe adding a member of the Reliquary to all point where there is a Cargo buyer could be another alternative.
- Why not just adding more shipwreck in the sea? I personnally think this would lack coherence. Having a sea full of wreck is not really pleasant to see and the actual dispersion is fine enough. Increasing rewards seems to me a better option.
- What about the pirates? Adding a reliquary on their island sounds a bit incoherent with the lore... But this could also be a way for them to pay back their infamy. Just an idea, I didn't think much about this part of the game I'm not familiar enough with.
- Why would we play with an exploration more lucrative when safe commmerce on continent is lucrative enough ? I think it only provides more opportunity for players, even if commerce is powerful enough to make money.
- Could we increase the number of packs found to push the player to by an additionnal pack place for a clipper/a speed boat/a shooner ? I really like the idea, but the question which is next is all about balencing. I am affraid this system, even if it makes more risks for the player (can be easily detected by the other boats, risks to pay the shattigon sand to repair, etc...) it means also more rewards. Following this idea, it could be possible to reduce the price offered by the Reliquary and Merchant for each pack.
- Consider more tokens and gold for a packet delivered to the Reliquary on Friedrich ? I would say I like this idea, but I tried to keep simple a system which is already complex enough here.
- Adding a token at each pack returned ? I like this idea too. As shown in the maths below, the value of a token is approximately 23s (based on the Dahuta's light returned). Adding 1 of them in the first step and maybe 2 on the second (or 3) may not do a great difference from a gold aspect but could support risky behavior to keep running the Reliquary task. As a drawback, this makes easier to collect the crates obtained (and thus, the Dahuta's light).

The maths behind it
The following data have been gathered empirically. They may not reflect the exact reality despite all efforts put into it. They also lack on the Haranian side. Any help acquired to improve the data about the actual game is welcome. All computations details are available from the python notebook attached.

The purpose was to compare the rewards obtained through commerce and compare them with exploration. Based on these statistics, different rewards can be established to balance the system.

If we consider the classical trade run Gwenoid forest to Solzreed (one of the most done from what I could see ingame), we estimate at 10.63h the time required to gather enough gold from the farm cart to the farm wagon. From this point, 4.95h are required to go to the hauler, 3.48h more to go to the freighter and 22.93 to get the costume. Voluntary, commerce has been computed to minimize results (since all packs are not at 130% all the time, price is decreased to 13g)

In comparison, getting the submarine with the schooner required for the expedition is 8 times more than all the previous added (349.42h)... but we can understand this comparison is not fair and does not bring much. Commerce is made to be lucrative and even if this proposition is thought to make exploration a bit more, we can keep this ratio under the commerce efficiency. Still, today exploration is not really made as it is not lucrative before the shooner and the submarine. This path tend to propose another way to proceed, giving more possibilities to reach this point, with maybe even more player "interactions" (=PVP)

As an average of 5.54 chests per hour, the exploration brings today an average of 11.23 gold per hour (computed over 72h of pure exploration with multiple people). We can compare this to the hourly profits of the different cart in the trade run :

- Hourly profit for farm cart: 89.14
- Hourly profit for farm wagon: 155.19
- Hourly profit for farm hauler: 221.24
- Hourly profit for farm freighter: 287.29
- Hourly profit for farm freighter with costume: 431.67

With a ratio of 0.2% drop rate for the "Ghost Memory" item and 5 chests/hour on average, we can estimate 1 memory/hour. The rest is established with the Reliquary runs.
As we can consider most of the packs returned on the continent for safety reason (we compare the safe trade runs, so we examine the safest estimation first). This means 20g for the run. With the sea cover, let's consider an arbitrary 20minutes (low estimation) to reach the pack, and 20 min to deliver it. This makes only 23.7433g with the additionnal classical 20min, but already double the hourly profits of the explorers... and this also remains approximately 4 times less than the lowest commerce cart (24g vs 89g).

If the character wishes to earn more with the Reliquary, its profits are decreased to 5g+20 min at 11.23g. This makes an expectation of 8.7433g for the first hour.
The next hour is considered as only hunting the Reliquary second packs, within 40 minutes.

This leads to either 40g by selling, and restarting the process at the rate of 11.23g for the 20 min remaining (43.7433g of this hour, still half of the basic farm cart).

Taking this into consideration, we can establish the following incomes rates based on "Reliquary" or "Merchant". Please note that everytime the player select option "merchant", he restarts his expectation:

ktNijHq.png


Considering the prices in AH, we obtained an average value of 3.4433g/crate opened (which requires previous runs for the Reliquary). From this point, we obtain the value of around 23s/token obtained working for the Reliquary. Last hour is not considered entirely (about what goes in the remaining minutes, since travel time can be highly variable).

We see this system tends to remain less lucrative than the "safe" commerce system, except when taking very high risks in comparison.
That is a very big and detailed idea. We'll have it saved and make sure to check into it.
 
It was made such low profit at a reason and we don't think that increasing it to 100g is a good idea.


Can you elaborate on why you think this? I'm curious because the 2nd pack that drops from chests is a 100g pack? The delphinad pottery pack and the perdita being of same value doesn't seem to be a big game changer to me.
 
Back
Top