Nerf Darkrunners before everyone is a darkrunner

[camigwenn]

Im sure this thread is going to be locked, but let me do a quick run through of why a mage is even more stupid than a darkrunner.

Let's assume we are in a small scale pvp situation, like a 10v10 or a 5v5. Come late game, on average, it takes a full rotation to kill a healer. This is not including things like other healers healing, or popping pots. When you factor in those two, suddenly it becomes much harder to kill a healer, and you might not even kill them. Let's say you did kill them with a full rotation. That would take roughly 5-6 seconds aftbefore they die, putting you out of position.

Lets say you are a spellsinger now. You press one button and you kill a fully buffed healer from 25 meters away, perfectly safe, with no counterplay.

Source: I was a spellsinger on live. Here are some of my 1 shots as a dual wield. I didn't even have a staff for maximum damage, and I had 1.3k mattk buffed, and not the best crit damage. Keep in mind that people with staffs and better gear than me hit 30k+ consistently on healers.

Epic buff archer that had an ancient library on.

Fully buffed healer. Not that impressive, but for a budget spellsinger on cloth it was pretty good.

This is what happens when someone doesn't have honor gems.

Trust me, mages are way worse.

Ehhhh, this typically doesnt happen though.

And you're not even taking into consideration the fact that 95% of the server runs Shrug it Off. Making those 50k arc lightning crits hit for 5k

 

[mikroman]

Soooo... long cast time mage skills have not bad damages... Just they have some small issues:
- target move out (30m+ and you lose target?)
- target use "mobility" skills and you lose target
- target hit you and it will interrupt casting
- target will hit you - CC you and you will not get back control before it will kill you with "basic" skills (DR).
Yeah, DR is not OP... just in 1st 2-4 months than it will reskill to endgame builds. Don't nerf BR because it can't free farm 100k honor in some weeks (or days)!


edit: but this is not the primary objective of "private" server and the Team. Fix the mistakes of developers is bigger work and it's hard to update in patches.

 

[Azi]

In all fairness, on live client in 2.9 i was a 3k gs darkrunner. i was able beat 6k gs players if i didnt mess up my combo. I can see how that would be useful on live client since it defeats pay2win, but if people feel like it's a bit too strong maybe it should be nerfed. However i would argue that darkrunners can be countered really easily by defense. I feel like I do no damage to that class.

 

[Bofur]

The truth is Darkrunners are amazing for people with low GS, they have a large advantage in the beginning because they have a high amount damage with low stats. Compared to a mage or an archer which abilities are heavily based off by their stats IE intelligence and agility. In endgame content lets just say around the 5k GS range for this argument, each fight will depend on skill or knowledge of the game more than class. Sure Darkrunners have the ability to crit for 20k+ in the right condition, but mages and archers can do the same thing. So know your combo's and learn how to counter them with your abilities and any class is beatable.

 

[notiggy]

The biggest issue with melee being so powerful is pre pop shrug and gems. Having everyone with 2-3 gems max allows DRs to hit really hard. The game isn't balanced on 2 gems, they expect people to be at 5-6. Reckoning was just as bad with the free mistsong weapons from upgrading GHA.

 

[BrainletDarkrunner]

I think we can all agree to get rid of the shrug and bondbreaker dmg reductions. This will make all classes better when you can’t click a button and turn of the damage for 5 seconds.

Yes yes I know this is a change in 3.0 but adding this now would make the game so much better in the next few months until 3.0 is released.

 

[ZapdosLegendaryPokemon]

3.0's def pen nerf is a big help. Problem would be: How do you nerf them? If you mess with any battlerage damage you start screwing over tanks. Its just a problem with this game and its "Pick three trees and that's your class"

screw tanks too, no reason you should be able to take raid boss levels of dmg and still one shot people.

 

[Wings]

raid boss levels of dmg and still one shot people

The fuck kind of tank can take "raidboss levels" of damage but still one-shot people? A tank's job is to soak up as much damage as possible. If you are a squish physical damage class you should not even be considering getting close to a tank. Mages are the one responsible for them.

Blighters and Abolishers are not tanks. They are bruisers because of their mobility. Tanks would be more along the lines of Paladin and Doomlord. Both these classes have either loads of CC to keep their target locked down or have decent CC and self sustain to increase the amount of damage they can soak.

 

[nebins]

The fuck kind of tank can take "raidboss levels" of damage but still one-shot people? A tank's job is to soak up as much damage as possible. If you are a squish physical damage class you should not even be considering getting close to a tank. Mages are the one responsible for them.

Blighters and Abolishers are not tanks. They are bruisers because of their mobility. Tanks would be more along the lines of Paladin and Doomlord. Both these classes have either loads of CC to keep their target locked down or have decent CC and self sustain to increase the amount of damage they can soak.

abolisher is 100% a tank class. its like the ultimate tank class

 

[Wings]

Ultimate tank right now but come 3.0 they are not very good. Lose shrug's synergy with boastful roar and revitalizing cheer. Conversion shield reduces received healing in 3.0 and will absorb less magic damage than in 2.9. This screws their tankiness by a good chunk. A few other things get changed as well but I'm not 100% on them so I wont bother mentioning them.

Though I was saying more by definition its not a tank since tanks in most MMO's do not have mobility but rather means of keeping the opponent locked down. This game is an exception not a rule with this stuff because of the "Pick Three Trees" class system.

Tanks also force you to attack them one way or another. Paladin can heal allies while they are being attacked, which makes them be more of a higher priority target. Doomlord and Skullknight can keep up with constant CC making them very annoying to leave alive. Abolishers are pretty much ignored in teamfights because of their single target damage and mobility. Thanks pretty much force a damned if you do; damned if you don't sort of situation.

 

[nebins]

Paladins are not a target at all. they can kinda heal but not really. A tanks job is to not die, abolishers have CC breaks to prevent themselves form being locked down. and if you are running paladin in raid comp your guild leader should publicly shame you. Its an ok dps and a not great heal. If in RvR you are focusing a paladin over actual healers you don't seem to understand raid fighting. Tanks in raids are initiators they essentially rush in first to pull some people onto them or single out someone.

 

[Wings]

I guess I should have specified smaller scale stuff vs RvR. Rules change depending on what you are doing. I'm more a fan of small scale stuff so that's where mindset lies and I'm sure knowing this will make my previous statements make a bit more sense. More builds are viable in the smaller scale than in RvR and I guess that's kinda where I was going with my previous post.

Won't argue at all that Pally is useless in RvR. Doomlord probably wouldn't do much more good than Pally other than staying in the back of their raid helping to lock down anyone that tries to mess with their healers. Probably would be more useful rolling SK and joining the others in the front line.

I guess where I'm being petty is more along the lines of Tank vs Bruiser. Bruisers would be beefy targets who deal damage and can chase down opponents and Tanks would be more stationary with much more beef and lock down. According to this definition I'd classify Abolisher as a Bruiser along with Blighter. This was my point going against Zapdos in that those classes that "take raid bosses level of damage and one shot people" statement. Bruisers and tanks are similar but certain abilities, such as dealing large amounts of burst damage or mobility, lies more with the Bruisers. Though I learned they are a Primeval so I can understand why they would be salty about tanks but it is not an archers job to kill tanks/bruisers.

 

[Lindzay]

2.9 is probably the worst balance pvp exists in in this game. You won't see a dark runner fix till 4.5 so yall are gonna be here waiting a long ass time.

 

[Jaylong]

this thread made me laugh




p.s Get Mad idiot

 

[maydewrq]

Ehhhh, this typically doesnt happen though.

And you're not even taking into consideration the fact that 95% of the server runs Shrug it Off. Making those 50k arc lightning crits hit for 5k

good thing shrug doesnt help against magic damage in 3.0. there is also a reason there are skills like imprison, summon crows, redoubt and lasso for those with issues about dr's disengage abilities. classes in this game are highly paper scissors rock imo, learn and adjust

 

[Jfoxx]

Nothing is wrong with darkrunner. The problem, however, is that archery is still 1-1-1-1-1.

You're not archering right. I don't hit 1-1-1-1.

 

[Tonk]

You're not archering right. I don't hit 1-1-1-1.

You will soon enough. Trust me.

 

[Bastrii]

The main problem with Dark Runners isn't their damage - their damage is high, yes, and could use tweening to be weaker. The main problem is that they have specific single target stun-trip-stun-trip combos that make it impossible to fight back. Sure, mages hit hard. But Dark Runners bum rush before anyone can really do anything.

Charge Snares, and pretty much insures that your first swipe of Triple Slash trips. Then you can Wallop > Overwhelm > Shadowsmite, giving you another Stun > Trip, then you can Throwing Dagger into Whirlwind Slash for a THIRD trip.

By then, your charge is almost off Cooldown, for another snare > trip.

There's two ways to deal with this:

1. Reduce the amount of trip combos with Battlerage+Shadowplay.

2. Reduce damage taken when under the Trip CC by 20% > 40% > 60% for each time you've been tripped, including the first. Only applies in PvP.

First option:
>Change Throwing Dagger into a Ranged Ability, giving it a minimum range of 8 meters and making the damage scale with Ranged Damage. To proc the slow with a Dark Runner, you would have to Backdrop first, wasting a GCD and the duration of one of your stuns. On top of that, you would deal less damage with it. Increase the duration of the slow from 3 seconds to 5.
>Triple slash no longer trips snared targets on first hit. (Trip is too powerful for a basic combo.) Instead, first hit hits applies a more powerful slow on the target, if they are already slow.
>Charge no longer snares, but inflicts slow for 3 seconds. (1.5 in PvP.) Slowed targets are stunned for 3 seconds. Defeating a target resets the cooldown. 24 second cool down. The Charge reset can occur once every 12 seconds.
>Whirlwind Slash pushes on the first hit. Trip is changed to stun for 3 seconds on slow targets. (1.5 in PvP)
These changes NEUTER their infinite stuns. Archery, Magic, nearly all classes play Cat and Mouse against Darkrunner to just avoid being stunlocked to death. It's too common.

Finally: Parrying attacks no longer resets all cooldowns.

Second Option: Reduce the effectiveness of Darkrunner CC.

Trips are VERY powerful, because there's nearly no ways to escape it without a very long cooldown. Darkrunners have three in a row. Each time you are tripped, you should gain the "Curl Up" Buff for the initial duration of the trip, that stacks up to three times.
First stack: Decreases melee damage received by 20%.
If you are tripped again when this buff is ongoing, even though you're already on the floor, you gain another stack.
Second stack: Decreases melee damage received by 40%.
By the end of the second trip, without this buff, you're down to 45% health. With this buff, your health should float around 65%. If you're tripped again, without having a chance to stand, you get it once more.
Third stack: Decreases melee damage received by 60%.
Normally, at the end of this combo, you're down to 20% of your Health. After this change, you should have at least 50%, minimum. If not more. This is by far the easiest solution to the problem.

 

[Jfoxx]

You will soon enough. Trust me.

Again, being one of the highest tiered archers.. I don't hit for 1-1-1-1.

 

[Jet]

This thread is a waste of time. Darkrunners will not get nerfed, so just get used to getting 1 combod with 55% physical def and max gems .