trapwhre02
Well-Known Member
That's not only rude it's also a shit argumentation. Everyone is free to think what they want and have their own opinion.
Should PLAYER NATIONS be removed?
- Thread starter Hny
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That's not only rude it's also a shit argumentation. Everyone is free to think what they want and have their own opinion.
Hny
Member
I‘m not closing this thread. It‘s an open discussion and I see new faces finding this thread and voicing their opinion on it. Even if no completly new points are added, it shows that more than just one person is sharing a certain opinion. If it bugs you so much that this thread exists, maybe you should get off it and find another activity you can put your time and energy in.
Aestru
New Member
Reading thru this thread I see valid points from both sides. Being relatively new to this game, gives me the luxury to try to be impartial.
What makes a good pvp game imo is balance. You are truly good at pvp when you beat an opponent who has roughly the same gear score, because it's about how you use your skills rather than to do your nails while the opponent is hammering at you for 5 minutes and then, bored, you one-shot him. That's not pvp.
On the other hand, if you expect to kill someone that has 3 times your gearscore, and complain you get one shot-ed, thats delusional.
From my point of view, both sides are right.
PN1 is right , that there are enough players in West that in group pvp can match them. It's just a matter of will. Filtering the anarchic douche bags that are on both sides, I'm sure that there are enough people capable of running organized events. Even pugs.
Casual pvp-ers ( I am one of them ) are more than capable and eager to learn and understand what is being told to them by the raidleader. Good leadership is recognized by both the winners and loosers.
If you loose, but put up a good fight, you will be appreciated by both your raid and the opposing raid . So keep at it. Find more people that can and are willing to lead. Don't be lazy potatoes and just follow the zerg. Even if your GS is low, go in, face the fact that, yes, you might be one shot-ed, but maybe you can get a CC in, or a trip and maybe your trip will keep him down long enough so the high GS people can finish him off.
The only way to learn is by doing it over and over again. PvP is not only about GS. It's also about skill.
Flipsy is right also, when he says that on certain events, PN1 shows up just to be douche bags and ruin the event, because, well, they can.
It's like going to the starter zone and one-shot-ing lvl 1 mobs and feel totally accomplished that you insta-killed the mighty lvl1 boar.... but each with his own.
The problem here is that you really can not force people not to be douche bags.
You can ask them not to be, but that's about it.
so, do NOT disband PN1. If you take away the reason to get geared up to kick their butts, then people will truly will become potatoes. The more I get killed in events, the more I am motivated to work to get my gear and my skills in shape.
What makes a good pvp game imo is balance. You are truly good at pvp when you beat an opponent who has roughly the same gear score, because it's about how you use your skills rather than to do your nails while the opponent is hammering at you for 5 minutes and then, bored, you one-shot him. That's not pvp.
On the other hand, if you expect to kill someone that has 3 times your gearscore, and complain you get one shot-ed, thats delusional.
From my point of view, both sides are right.
PN1 is right , that there are enough players in West that in group pvp can match them. It's just a matter of will. Filtering the anarchic douche bags that are on both sides, I'm sure that there are enough people capable of running organized events. Even pugs.
Casual pvp-ers ( I am one of them ) are more than capable and eager to learn and understand what is being told to them by the raidleader. Good leadership is recognized by both the winners and loosers.
If you loose, but put up a good fight, you will be appreciated by both your raid and the opposing raid . So keep at it. Find more people that can and are willing to lead. Don't be lazy potatoes and just follow the zerg. Even if your GS is low, go in, face the fact that, yes, you might be one shot-ed, but maybe you can get a CC in, or a trip and maybe your trip will keep him down long enough so the high GS people can finish him off.
The only way to learn is by doing it over and over again. PvP is not only about GS. It's also about skill.
Flipsy is right also, when he says that on certain events, PN1 shows up just to be douche bags and ruin the event, because, well, they can.
It's like going to the starter zone and one-shot-ing lvl 1 mobs and feel totally accomplished that you insta-killed the mighty lvl1 boar.... but each with his own.
The problem here is that you really can not force people not to be douche bags.
You can ask them not to be, but that's about it.
so, do NOT disband PN1. If you take away the reason to get geared up to kick their butts, then people will truly will become potatoes. The more I get killed in events, the more I am motivated to work to get my gear and my skills in shape.
Kezz
Active Member
Without all the long drawn out replies. Without any complicated reasoning.
Yes they need to be removed. The player base is much more interesting and the pvp is more fun without it. The live server is proof that West and East factions just die otherwise. Same happened to this server.
Just give the current PN's compensation while the server is low on population. Cut the PN. And when the server starts to breath life again, it will be more interesting and will draw in more new players.
Yes they need to be removed. The player base is much more interesting and the pvp is more fun without it. The live server is proof that West and East factions just die otherwise. Same happened to this server.
Just give the current PN's compensation while the server is low on population. Cut the PN. And when the server starts to breath life again, it will be more interesting and will draw in more new players.
Drunkenhero
Active Member
Lmao, go dissect someone else, yet again no merit to all of that. If you are too busy commenting on each section of something I type, then yet again more reasons for the thread to close. It's also Schrodinger's Ignorance, actually read something before actually insulting someone. I have not directed anything towards a person, don't direct things at me.
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Drunkenhero
Active Member
There were a few valid points to it, the main ones being the heaviest GS folks being in the same groups. But how is fair to force them apart as well? They do happen to be friends as well. Changing some of the economics involved looked to be the most promising thing mentioned. Otherwise you are just going to make more people stop playing, since they cannot play with their friends.
Edit:
They are also stuck where they are with items, gearing and such that is static to the faction they started with. They took a path that led them to the place they are through game mechanics and now people are basically saying NO YOU HAVE TO BE SPLIT UP, due to winning the top level 5% of the video game.. I do not see that as healthy for the server at all. It will force not only players to leave, but some who actually donate to said server.
Zing™
Active Member
You're not adding anything at this point, but please forgive me as I stoop to conquer. It's Schrödinger, in his native German (he was Austrian), but as I'm from an English speaking country, I'm not blessed with convenient umlauts on my keyboard. In which case the convention to add an e to make it Schroedinger (to reflect how the umlaut modifies the o) is perfectly acceptable if a little old-fashioned. If you want to insult my level of education, you'll have to do better than that. Bad day for you.
Back on a less personal note, you're trying to dismiss arguments without presenting anything. The thread doesn't need to close, you just need to either pull your finger out, or stop posting.
I'm not sure how economics stop people being friends, but okay. You haven't presented a solid idea of what these economic ideas are that I've seen - if it's that good, let us know. I'm genuinely interested.
No items, gear or builds will cease to be useful as a result of the PN dynamic changing. Simply not possible, and builds are changed on the fly dependent on what people are doing.
Certainly if there is significant change some people might leave. There will always be those that aren't happy with change and will leave, that's the nature of change and the ornery nature of people. There are suggestions above that include less revolutionary change than removing the PNs; would you care to comment on those? What we DO know however, is that with the PN dynamic not being changed at all, that people will leave, that people have stopped doing pvp events. We benefit from hindsight, we've seen what happened on live and how the game started dying on its ass. The devs here can tinker to achieve a more 'healthy' and balanced gameplay, and have with the trade system and numerous other instances. It's okay to discuss these.
I'm sure you won't read this, as you, a man of you word, threatened to ignore the thread before (but somehow magically managed to respond twice above trying to be clever and failing, bless). If you have something to contribute, such as the economic changes to you keep alluding to, lay them out and let's all have a look.
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What are the benefits of having PNs to the server's health? The only thing I can think of is something to aspire to conquer / join. However, if you attempt to conquer you will be suppressed by both at once if you are strong enough.
Considering that, back the original question; What are the benefits of having PNs to the server's health?
Considering that, back the original question; What are the benefits of having PNs to the server's health?
trapwhre02
Well-Known Member
I'm sorry if I'm just that blind but I can't stop thinking about one thing. I see people asking a similar question spread over these 7 pages, yet I can't find a constructive answer to it.
I'm talking about this type of question:
Correct me if I'm wrong. Nobody has answered that question with logical argumentation yet. All I've seen is "PNs just find other ways to continue doing what they do now." - Which is a faulty argumentation. Those people saying that are referring to them just going pirate, keeping castles with alt guilds in vanilla factions, I assume. But pirate clearly isn't the same and can't ever be the same as PNs, no matter how hard you try. If it was, there wouldn't be PNs.
Pirate faction has a player limit, no ? PNs are theoretically infinite.
Pirates get sent to jail if interrupting mainland events (CR/GR, Halcyona - the most common ones).
Temporarily flipping pirate back to vanilla faction (to defend a castle or farm honor etc.) isn't as easy and cheap compared to when you are doing it as a PN player.
It's no secret the server is in an injured state in terms of population. So again, I'm asking the same question, previous people have asked: What are the benefits of keeping PNs (or not adjusting them at the very least), to the servers population and general health ?
This thread has 127 replies, with 3K visitors. Regardless of not having 3K unique individuals visiting this, you can with no doubt say, that this thread has received outstanding attention. Are you telling me there is not one person able to give us a solid explaination why we should continue to let PNs kill the server ?
The server is at it's nadir right now, PN is busy playing other games or servers like many of us. If nobody can give a proper answer to above mentioned question, now is the best time to shut them down or tweak them to lower their negative impact they have on just about everything.
I'm talking about this type of question:
Correct me if I'm wrong. Nobody has answered that question with logical argumentation yet. All I've seen is "PNs just find other ways to continue doing what they do now." - Which is a faulty argumentation. Those people saying that are referring to them just going pirate, keeping castles with alt guilds in vanilla factions, I assume. But pirate clearly isn't the same and can't ever be the same as PNs, no matter how hard you try. If it was, there wouldn't be PNs.
Pirate faction has a player limit, no ? PNs are theoretically infinite.
Pirates get sent to jail if interrupting mainland events (CR/GR, Halcyona - the most common ones).
Temporarily flipping pirate back to vanilla faction (to defend a castle or farm honor etc.) isn't as easy and cheap compared to when you are doing it as a PN player.
It's no secret the server is in an injured state in terms of population. So again, I'm asking the same question, previous people have asked: What are the benefits of keeping PNs (or not adjusting them at the very least), to the servers population and general health ?
This thread has 127 replies, with 3K visitors. Regardless of not having 3K unique individuals visiting this, you can with no doubt say, that this thread has received outstanding attention. Are you telling me there is not one person able to give us a solid explaination why we should continue to let PNs kill the server ?
The server is at it's nadir right now, PN is busy playing other games or servers like many of us. If nobody can give a proper answer to above mentioned question, now is the best time to shut them down or tweak them to lower their negative impact they have on just about everything.
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Lionheart
New Member
This will be my last post on this thread because I'm tired.
1. Player Nation is a guild's endgame goal.
Archeage starts off as a faction based game and over time, inter factions wars start. PN's are the endgame solution for guilds that don't really see this game as a faction v faction but as guild vs guild.
For a guild to create a PN it requires organisation and some type of member commitment to raise the money for it (remember that when PN1 was created it was way before it was only 100k-150k to make it). The guild also needs to fight off their enemies who might be trying to stop them doing the questline to create the PN.
The guild after their effort can now recruit both factions allowing their friends to join them.
You simply cannot tell those people that have been playing together through the game mechanics, "hey fk off split up because I'm getting farmed at halcy"
Their gaming is as important as yours
2. People still don't understand that Archeage is a brutal game for guilds.
This isn't like other MMOs, on Archeage there are winners and losers, and the losers usually quit/die off/disband/ join other guilds to try to combat the winners.
The winners usually get ahead in gear because of the gold that endgame content generates and with that they usually suppress their enemies, and the only REAL way to catch up is through p2w, that's the whole idea behind the game.
3. The real issue is that there are no real PvP leaders playing in the west faction.
PNs getting disbanded won't change the fact that West will continue to get farmed, instead of dying to 8 PN1 in halcy, you would be dying to 7 east players of PN1 +10 east pugs.
tldr. look in the mirror first
1. Player Nation is a guild's endgame goal.
Archeage starts off as a faction based game and over time, inter factions wars start. PN's are the endgame solution for guilds that don't really see this game as a faction v faction but as guild vs guild.
For a guild to create a PN it requires organisation and some type of member commitment to raise the money for it (remember that when PN1 was created it was way before it was only 100k-150k to make it). The guild also needs to fight off their enemies who might be trying to stop them doing the questline to create the PN.
The guild after their effort can now recruit both factions allowing their friends to join them.
You simply cannot tell those people that have been playing together through the game mechanics, "hey fk off split up because I'm getting farmed at halcy"
Their gaming is as important as yours
2. People still don't understand that Archeage is a brutal game for guilds.
This isn't like other MMOs, on Archeage there are winners and losers, and the losers usually quit/die off/disband/ join other guilds to try to combat the winners.
The winners usually get ahead in gear because of the gold that endgame content generates and with that they usually suppress their enemies, and the only REAL way to catch up is through p2w, that's the whole idea behind the game.
3. The real issue is that there are no real PvP leaders playing in the west faction.
PNs getting disbanded won't change the fact that West will continue to get farmed, instead of dying to 8 PN1 in halcy, you would be dying to 7 east players of PN1 +10 east pugs.
tldr. look in the mirror first
trapwhre02
Well-Known Member
Your post doesn't answer the question, as to how PNs are healthy to the server.
Yes, you can. Just like hiram screwed veteran players, making their gear less valuable as there is then another way of getting similar gear with less effort.
Your selfish mindset is what ruins this server. This is about long-term solutions and whether people like it initially or not, they'll get used to it.
ArcheAge players always had to adapt, they will continue to do so. And removing or adjusting PN, they will do it again, and if they decide to quit, then that is a worthy loss if they get replaced by at least 1 new player. Besides, nobody is forced to split up, Pirate faction always exists.
It will change things, you're lying to yourself if you deny it. Since you took halcy as example: PN won't longer play god at mainland events, deciding who gets to win regardless of faction-wide progress. If either nuia or haranya get their shit together and win halcyona due to sheer dedication and commitment, then there shouldn't be a third party blocking your rewards.
Our current player pool is limited. New players are infinite. I don't understand how people are trying to value the stubborn needs of a couple old players over those of potential new ones, when we are clearly facing a population issue.
And stop acting like we are taking anything from you by asking to disband/adjust PNs. Nobody touches the tons of boss-mats & LCs you were able to hoard over the past months, nobody is touching any of your gear that you were able to improve to where it is at now.
Yes, you can. Just like hiram screwed veteran players, making their gear less valuable as there is then another way of getting similar gear with less effort.
Your selfish mindset is what ruins this server. This is about long-term solutions and whether people like it initially or not, they'll get used to it.
ArcheAge players always had to adapt, they will continue to do so. And removing or adjusting PN, they will do it again, and if they decide to quit, then that is a worthy loss if they get replaced by at least 1 new player. Besides, nobody is forced to split up, Pirate faction always exists.
It will change things, you're lying to yourself if you deny it. Since you took halcy as example: PN won't longer play god at mainland events, deciding who gets to win regardless of faction-wide progress. If either nuia or haranya get their shit together and win halcyona due to sheer dedication and commitment, then there shouldn't be a third party blocking your rewards.
Our current player pool is limited. New players are infinite. I don't understand how people are trying to value the stubborn needs of a couple old players over those of potential new ones, when we are clearly facing a population issue.
And stop acting like we are taking anything from you by asking to disband/adjust PNs. Nobody touches the tons of boss-mats & LCs you were able to hoard over the past months, nobody is touching any of your gear that you were able to improve to where it is at now.
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Kezz
Active Member
The server health lowered considerably even on the live server after the release of the PN's.
If you want to stay with your friends, then just go pirate. I had to do it on the live server because I was west and had a lot of east friends.
There will only be benefits to removing PN's. That is why they have been removed in the Korean version. I don't believe they plan on releasing them again on the live server either.
If you want to stay with your friends, then just go pirate. I had to do it on the live server because I was west and had a lot of east friends.
There will only be benefits to removing PN's. That is why they have been removed in the Korean version. I don't believe they plan on releasing them again on the live server either.
Vinchino
Member
Having to re-gear is not comparable to having to re-friend. You're overlooking the fact that player nations are a feature that's already in the game and not an upcoming feature. Our community has been a thing for a very long time and nobody that's west faction in pn wants to be forced into the zerg that cries about every instance of pvp.
If the admins remove player nations and separate the community, the people here will quit. West will zerg east with no intervention. East will quit because they are under-geared and far outnumbered. West will have no one to fight. West will quit. Server dies.
If the admins remove player nations but give us a choice to re-chose our character's faction, everyone will choose east. The east will actually have competent leaders. West will get steamrolled. West is frail and quits when it's even numbers. You can't even tell me I'm wrong. Every time we ally east, west doesn't show up to anything.
Sure, you can make an argument that player nations are bad for server health. But your solutions to fixing the problem are astronomically worse for server health than leaving things as they are.
Okay, you're wrong. The rest of my response down below is a mixture between a reply to you and Lionheart. Happy reading!
You think we care if that's the outcome? Like I said numerous times in this thread, I was leading Halcy when it was 9 Nuians against a full raid of East getting farmed, 6 weeks straight. We aren't averse to getting steamrolled.
If there is a cross-country race between two people, we don't think the guy who hitches a ride with a passing car should be the one to win.
If there is a dog show and it's down to Mr. Jones' poodle and Mrs. Bixby's dachshund, if a leopard shows up unexpectedly we don't think the winner should be whomever's dog survives getting mauled by a leopard.
If there is an amateur hot dog eating competition, we don't think the guy who brings a starving Joey Chestnut to help him out should be allowed to win.
If two middle school football teams are playing a game, we don't think the team that substitutes in anyone from the NFL should be allowed to win.
We all want to fight in an event designed to be East vs West without interference. It is a PVP event designed for that and one that allows people the ability to lead and get better in an isolated environment to prepare for PVP elsewhere. If PN allies East, East doesn't learn much...sure they gain something, but there isn't much of a learning experience for their leadership and their PVP-interested members. If PN doesn't ally East, they wipe both sides as they see fit until one side gets tired (although seeing the screenies from before, it seems to be a clear favoring of the East). In both situations, PN is playing God to an event they have no benefit from and each side learns nothing because you guys are more coordinated than pugs, don't have the language barrier the factions have, and while you guys can be prideful that pride doesn't get in the way of you working together like it does for the 2 vanilla factions.
I also enjoy hearing "well you guys outnumber East". Is that OUR fault? Is it OUR fault that one week it was 65v70 in Halcy for the first time in months, and the next week it was 5v50 because a majority of the East left to PN? If that's what you're saying, we're flattered! But when my friends left to PN, I got murdered, helped murder them, and shot the shit with them later. I don't see how being in opposing factions immediately equates to "not friends anymore". Are you guys that frail you can't fight each other in opposing factions? Shit NOW IT MAKES SENSE! It simply sounds like you calling the West frail is projecting.
Vinchino
Member
You're so delusional it's unreal. You literally admitted in this thread that you disband your raid if you don't have the numbers.
If anyone is struggling to make sense of these shit tier analogies, I'll break them down:
"Delete pn so we can unfairly zerg east every halcy for our 5 medals sparkle pls."
Can I see this rule book to halcyona that states whos allowed to attend and whos not? Weird that no one else has seen or heard about it.
Halcyona is not an "isolated environment". It's literally an open world pvp event.
So is it east's fault the good majority of east stopped playing/showing up to halcyona? It's literally no one's fault. You're not even good at playing this victim card you so desperatle adhere to.
I also like the part where flipsy didn't respond to any of the points I made in my last post because he knows they're true.
tldr:
Flipsy is still desperate for player nations to be removed so he can zerg east's 20 man raid with west's 50 man raid.
I enjoy the cherry-picking, it's really odd to have someone calling me delusional when you can't even comprehend English correctly AND can't do math or deductive reasoning in a mildly-competent manner. Here, let me break it down for you:
-If we bring 40 and you bring 12 and wipe the raid, 10 of that 40 leave. Guaranteed. No convincing fixes that.
-By deductive reasoning, if 40 couldn't take you on, 30 couldn't take you on.
-Handfuls of people who stay ask if they're cool to leave.
Sorry I'd rather keep people happy in the face of defeat than tell them to fight a brick wall when they're already down. But I don't look at you and say "fuck it" and hit the disband button. I am not Zielony, I am not Volpe, I am not Tax. I keep going until a majority of the people are unhappy and then cut my losses. It's just a few medals to me anyway, I'm already sitting on 1100 of them.
It must be hard coming up with another reason why we want something to be done about PN participation in an event meant for the vanilla factions
I mean...it's in the quest line.
https://archeage.gamepedia.com/The_War_for_Halcyona (NPC in front of the portal in each Capital City: Marianople and Austera)
https://www.ign.com/wikis/archeage/Battle_for_the_Golden_Plains (Questgiver for this quest is either the Nuia or Haranya Alliance captain)
I don't see a "Player Nation Alliance base" block of text on the map. I see a "Player Nation Defense Base" in Whalesong Harbor, so it's not like the game map is missing that information. Weird, do you see something I don't?
Majority of the East's force (from what I remember) came from Lads and uwu, who went to PN not long after that super-long Halcy we had where it was like...60v70. I'm not saying it's anyone's fault, but using that whole "white knight" shit argument of "you'll just steamroll East' is just in bad taste, because it isn't OUR fault that reset Halcy went from East outnumbering us by 10 to West outnumbering East by 30, yet that's the rebuttal I keep getting.
What point? That you are afraid you'll be unable to hang out in discord with them and play other games if you go back to your home factions yet there are hundreds of friendships still going on despite those people being in opposing factions? That some of the most toxic people on the server will quit if PN's get removed? What point do you want me to dispute? I agree with both of them!
Except West doesn't even pull 30. MAYBE 40 on a good day. Plus, the East is bringing more numbers in with some real firepower behind them, they're turning it around after the single-digits Footlong had! But back on topic, do you think my plan is to stick around with the West raid and keep leading? You've seen what happens when I take a day off of leading reset raid or Halcyona. No one on West shows up. I don't want to lead Halcy forever. It's 3 hours past when I want to go to bed, and yet whenever you guys show up to Halcy, guess who has his DM's blown up to lead the raid.
My plan was to take Trickster out of the raid and start helping other players who want to lead do it. Taking out some of the heaviest hitters the West raid has would level the playing field immensely, but again...every time you guys show up, I get asked to come lead because I (depressingly) have the highest success rate against what you guys have. No joke, if you don't bring any PN to a Halcy, I am quite honestly interested in seeing what a pure East vs West raid would do without my getting physically involved. Without my heavy hitters getting involved. But many of your members log in JUST to join/disrupt Halcyona and so I can't do that. But eventually, I'd like to go to bed at a decent hour, or spend an evening doing something else and have others lead. Yet if I don't lead, I get spammed by people asking me to do so, I get hate mail from people who assume I tell the West to no-show Halcy, and all of this shit is honestly quite ridiculous when you put it all together.
Vinchino
Member
What are you even saying? "I'm delusional because I don't comprehend english or math"? I literally restated exactly what you previously said. It's not cherry picking when it's your core argument for the post. So which is it pal, do you stay and get farmed? or do you disband? You can't do both. Clearly you're pissed and throwing out random insults. Nice lmao.
It must be hard coming up with another reason why we want something to be done about PN participation in an event meant for the vanilla factions
I mean...it's in the quest line.
https://archeage.gamepedia.com/The_War_for_Halcyona (NPC in front of the portal in each Capital City: Marianople and Austera)
https://www.ign.com/wikis/archeage/Battle_for_the_Golden_Plains (Questgiver for this quest is either the Nuia or Haranya Alliance captain)
I don't see a "Player Nation Alliance base" block of text on the map. I see a "Player Nation Defense Base" in Whalesong Harbor, so it's not like the game map is missing that information. Weird, do you see something I don't?
I'm not interested in the game lore, I'm interested in actual game mechanics (something I know you care very little of learning). So once again I ask, where is the rule stating who is allowed and who isn't allowed in the zone? I didn't realize we were playing live in an instanced halcyona.
White knight shit? lmao. The rebuttal isn't that it's west's fault. The rebuttal is it's no one's fault. The rebuttal is east is getting zerged so we help east... what is so complicated that your walnut-sized brain can't comprehend that?
"Sparkle pls remove pn. They're mean to me and they don't let me zerg east. :'(."
All of this text is irrelevant, You outnumber east on a 1:3 ratio and still cry about the game being unfair to you.
TLDR:
Flipsy is still pissed and wants pn removed so he can zerg east.
Find where I said the words "I disband raids", please! And coming from the guy who recently called me delusional and comically insulting my gear score from the beginning like it mattered, you must've been pissed from the first post you made on this thread. Nice lmao.
Cherry-picking. I said the EVENT was a PVP event designed for for East vs West. The portals aren't lore-based, they're mechanic-based. Nothing about the zone limitations itself was mentioned. I am making the statement that the event itself should be an isolated environment, as implied by the East Alliance Base, West Alliance Base, and the lack of Player Nation Alliance Base.
You clear out both sides, but even with close-to-even numbers, you guys still help East. Even if 10 West show, you still help East. When East outnumbered West 5:1 you didn't do a thing about it. So stop trying to act like you're fair and proper in all of this when no matter the situation, you favor East in any and all scenarios.
Text isn't irrelevant just because I'm nice enough to take myself out of a PVP situation to level a playing field because you can't think of another way to use your power besides overstacking the side you favor the most. Also, you do realize I talk to some people who attend reset Halcy, right? Not even a week ago, it was 18 West to 25 East. Yesterday we brought 29 (which was a lot for a Saturday), and they had "a little more than 20". Please stop the hyperbole because it really degrades your entire argument. At reset Halcy raids, Trickster brings a constant 9-15 members. If I take Trickster out of the equation, the numbers are damn-near equal. And that's all I care about is making it more even, even if it means I don't get physically involved. Like, legit, I don't care about winning. I started getting outnumbered LITERALLY 5:1.
When will you understand that I personally don't want that? Zerging them teaches West nothing. Zerging them teaches East nothing. When East was zerging West, at no point did you guys come in to help stop that. So please stop with the one-sided arguments. By all means, let's have a civil conversation outside of here and have a chat about it, because I'm being sincere with you here. I am trying to foster healthy PVP with what's left behind in the vanilla factions, and trying to improve things at this simple event so people get more confident, but it's difficult for others to step up because of something as simple as Halcy. I had to face a hard wall with the East for me to learn how to lead. But you guys are an entire other step, and while that's an improvement for ME, it's too high of a task for someone just starting out with leading content raids.
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