What's new
By:
Filters

4.0 Gems System Debates

This thread is not about replacing 4.0 with 3.5s or keeping 3.5s in 4.0
It is about how the gem system should be done
Whether this is not incorporate 4.0s system
only have 4.0s
Make all 3.5 gems that are removed into a new 4.0 variant

The thread is about what the players think is the best course of action.
Even if that is scrapping the entire current system and building off of a best of both patches
 
Thinking said:
"A lot of the old gems will actually be worse for newer players once the patch is launched, imagine trying to full gem something with old gems (they still have rng in 4.0) and on top of that the 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th gem slot taking anywhere from 500-2000 gold each attempt (plus still having a chance to fail)."
Click to expand...

THAT IS THE WHOLE POINT

If you're a new player, you go with the no-fail ones and once you have the gold you use the better gems with the RNG rate. This is still a MMO, not a, get what you wish for.
 
I believe if we re-introduce the old gems in 4.0, they should have the RNG factor in them. This should not be removed. Work for your gear and gold. Those gems are obviously "more useful" for certain classes and shouldn't be handed out so easily.

Just adjust the recipe so they're crafteable the same way others are going to be crafted.

Also, any way to exchange the Memory Shards we already have? I'd be sad if I had to sell them to the vendor, because I've been stacking up on them for ages but Lunarite hasn't been in the Credit Boxes for a little while lol
 
trapwhre02 said:
Wait, either you two above me are missunderstanding the thread or I am.

This isn't about replacing the 4.0 gems with our 3.5 ones, it's about whether we should get to keep the 3.5 gems in addition to those that 4.0 introduces, or am I wrong ?

Because @Thinking you make it sound like new players don't have the ability to use the new no-fail gems when we keep the old ones.
Click to expand...

I've been talking about keeping the class specific gems that are otherwise removed in a way that fits in with the 4.0 system. Where did i mention replacing the new system? :rolleyes:
 
Thinking said:
A lot of the old gems will actually be worse for newer players once the patch is launched, imagine trying to full gem something with old gems (they still have rng in 4.0) and on top of that the 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th gem slot taking anywhere from 500-2000 gold each attempt (plus still having a chance to fail).

Even if you keep old gems or remove them, 4.0 is not a good patch for a new, lower geared, or even average player, no matter how you look at it. 4.0 is definitely a "rich get richer" patch.

- If we keep old gems in the 4.0 patch, people will still have to deal with the RNG associated with them, on top of the additional gold cost to socket, which makes it harder to gear than it is now for new/undergeared players

- If we remove the ability to craft old gems but keep the existing ones in the 4.0 patch, there will be a finite supply of the old gems which will make them harder to obtain for not only newer/undegeared players but also for middle of the pack average players. Wealthy players will stockpile these and use them for themselves or sell at a premium. (4.0 default change)

- If we remove the ability to craft the old gems, make them unrecoverable through mornstoning, and make the existing supply of them unable to socket, nobody will be able to obtain old gems except people who already had them in the gear and even then, you won't be able to upgrade that piece of gear if you want to retain those gems. This is really the only way to prevent new/average/undergeared players from getting price gouged, but this still isn't a perfect solution because it doesn't really allow them to catch up to the top 5% stat wise in the same manner.

Regardless of how you look at it, 4.0 is an awful patch for pretty much everyone but the top 100/established/wealthy from a balancing standpoint. All of the potential solutions make it harder for people towards the bottom of the spectrum.



Frigid tracks gem still exists for belt slot, it reduces frigid tracks cast time by a percentage, not a flat amount. There isn't a reason to keep both old and new frigid tracks gems.



zeal gems are not very balanced in a meta of inflated critical bonus and rate, zeal itself was progressively nerfed in essentially every patch from 4.5 onwards for this reason



More than likely they would create new recipes to make the old gems with the new mats, having two different material systems is bound to be extremely confusing and not to mention, annoying to work around.
Click to expand...


For frigid tracks the flat reduction is better for new players because % reduction is only going to be good if your base cast time is good which takes forever to get down.
 
I have already said before that I don't want the 2nd version of class gems to disappear and to keep both versions, for example: vitalism cast time reduced revive and increased fervent healing, and songcraft zeal and startling strain gems. No one really crafted class specific gems anymore on live because the ones the devs chose to keep were mostly utterly useless.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Hny
Sjinderson said:
This thread is not about replacing 4.0 with 3.5s or keeping 3.5s in 4.0
It is about how the gem system should be done
Click to expand...

But, if we say the gem system should be done by combining both systems, doesn't that still answer the question "how should the gem system be done?"?
 
You've missed the point of my response.
It is not about 1 way of doing the system but rather a way of doing the system that a majority can be happy about.
If that majority were to say combine both systems then yes that is the end result.

The point I was trying to make was don't just think add 3.5 gems to 4.0 or change 4.0 gems in some way/not add them
 
Hny said:
I believe if we re-introduce the old gems in 4.0, they should have the RNG factor in them. This should not be removed. Work for your gear and gold. Those gems are obviously "more useful" for certain classes and shouldn't be handed out so easily.

Just adjust the recipe so they're crafteable the same way others are going to be crafted.

Also, any way to exchange the Memory Shards we already have? I'd be sad if I had to sell them to the vendor, because I've been stacking up on them for ages but Lunarite hasn't been in the Credit Boxes for a little while lol
Click to expand...
"work for your gear and gold" . . . You do know that 4.0 gems aren't free or as easy to get as before? They're just guaranteed to socket.

Anyhow, my vote is make there be 4.0 equivalents of removed gems and put their costs in line. Please don't make us wait til 4.5 and beyond to get Tier 3 versions of honor gems and whatnot. The whole point of the system should be reducing RNG factors and give proper gear progression, but removing T3 then putting no break tier 2's that cost a hell of a lot more with no RNG is just giving the gear struggle a new name.
 
The new gem system looks great, but I'm worried that the resale of old gems can be abused at high prices for new people, given that some of the old ones are still better than their corresponding level 2.

Maybe you could add the old gems with some craft that involves charcoal, and everyone decides whether to use new, old or both :)

The evasion gems of the new system also disappear (in future patches they bring them back) could you put them now?

By the way, does anyone know how much profession you need to do the craft of the new gems?
 
Sjinderson said:
You've missed the point of my response.
It is not about 1 way of doing the system but rather a way of doing the system that a majority can be happy about.
If that majority were to say combine both systems then yes that is the end result.

The point I was trying to make was don't just think add 3.5 gems to 4.0 or change 4.0 gems in some way/not add them
Click to expand...
just how the trade system was done, leaving the old system and implementing the new cargo i believe that the lunagem should be done the same way changing the recipe to require the new materials and be 100% socketable and cost the same increased gold amount as the new ones will. this will allow new players to catch up a bit in GS since we have allot of people already over the 8k and many guilds killing low gear players while trading since the basically get no penalty. (honor is costumed buffed in this server so they can buy many of those crime point potions and not have to worry about it). i believe that by doing it this way allot of people are going to be happy specially players that would like to start here. i dont know thats just my 0,2 cents o7
 
Similar to the old/new trade systems being present, both styles of gems being present will allow newer players to gear in similar ways to the current high end player base. This will also allow for more economics in the game, which currently is in a lull as the server itself never generates enough gold to support the playerbase.
 
Aviendha said:
I have already said before that I don't want the 2nd version of class gems to disappear and to keep both versions, for example: vitalism cast time reduced revive and increased fervent healing, and songcraft zeal and startling strain gems. No one really crafted class specific gems anymore on live because the ones the devs chose to keep were mostly utterly useless.
Click to expand...

this sounds great !!

edit:
please don't remove memory shards
 
Last edited:
Is the intention to give us the patch notes with plenty of time to respond to them? Or is it going to be a mad panic from the community to get issues resolved before release?
 
Patch Notes will have the final version of updates, that will be implemented with 4.0 release.
If you have any suggestions on the changes, you need to provide them now, without waiting for the patch notes.
 
I've given my thoughts both in this thread and the main 4.0 discussion, but there has been no real response to the vast majority of peoples comments, so the community has no idea if we're being listened to or just shouting into the wind ;)

Guess we'll have to wait and see how things pan out. An actual discussion between players and staff is what was needed though, to avoid angry panicked responses if theres stuff the community is against.
 
DrRageQuit said:
I've given my thoughts both in this thread and the main 4.0 discussion, but there has been no real response to the vast majority of peoples comments, so the community has no idea if we're being listened to or just shouting into the wind ;)

Guess we'll have to wait and see how things pan out. An actual discussion between players and staff is what was needed though, to avoid angry panicked responses if theres stuff the community is against.
Click to expand...
We read all the suggestion and they are taken into account by us.
 
In the current state of the server adding crit rate gems to the head piece and 100% socketable crit damage gems to bow, weapons will legit just increase the gear gap between new & existing players further. Imo don't add them.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top